If the student loan vote purchasing scam actually happens, it will set a new precedent in election politics that will be the beginning of our country's death spiral. There is simply no justification for paying $10K to, as the left loves to castigate, privileged citizens, that want to breach their contract with the US to repay their debt.
The only way this becomes fair is for every tax payor to receive a check for $10K that didn't have student loans to forgive. I only type that so as to show how ludicrous the concept is. We've entered into a time where the left is dismantling the fabric of bipartisan governance. They are using impeachment as a political tool, raiding former President's homes, attempting to stack the SCOTUS, changing election laws on the fly, introducing systemic racism into our education and federal bureaucracy, and weaponizing our federal agencies to destroy citizens that disagree with the status quo.
Common Sense, and Substack, and some other rogue podcasts, are our only hopes to fight back, as conventional media are actively helping to destroy our country through their blind advocacy of the progressive movement.
I believe Substack may be the Underground Railroad of our times. Perhaps we will reclaim our freedom through the courage of a few good men & women.
As for your suggestion of $10,000 for each of us .... emphatically, no! Don't be a piker. A million in cash, an electric car in the driveway, &, of course, a chicken in the pot is what we deserve.
Yes, the democrats have put Saul Alinsky’s tactics on steroids. Any means to the end. It’s obvious when looking at the events over the past 4 years. Expect more leading up to the November election.
This is basically Obama's third term. All the old Chicago politics 'any means to an end' scorched earth tactics. All the old players, from BHO, Michelle, Susan Rice, Samantha Powers, Valerie Jarrett, et al are behind the scenes promoting policies that they failed to enact during his term. The resurrection of the Iran negotiations are proof.
Yes, I’ve followed this issue very closely and know how much consternation this causes inside of Israel. That’s why Obama and Biden’s position on JCPOA is so puzzling. It is very frustrating to me that Jewish American democrats have not abandoned their party over this issue. Makes no sense.
It makes no sense Brian. However, what’s not puzzling to me is the position those two presidents have taken on the JCPOA, Biden just a puppet for Obama and both don’t care about Israel. So maybe after Biden goes back to the deal and gives Iran the billions of $$$ they are bitching about and there is an escalation in hostilities for Israel and ultimately for America then the American Jews will finally realize what their Democratic Party has become and finally make a break from them, I’m not holding my breath!
Why stop at student loans? Let's forgive home loans, car loans, gambling addicts' dept. Hell, let's abolish all loans. Where does it end? If you watched the loan debate on IQ2US, you saw that it immediately degenerated into a racial problem. Why is everything and I mean everything on the left racial?
All it tells me is that the left panders to race. They can't debate you on the issues so they immediately scream RACE! The definition of a racist is anyone who wins and argument with a leftist.
On a side note, the author says he doesn't believe in God but he still uses TGIF. Here are two alternatives:
As an aside on the racial issue and debt, the black students in my state university system medical school received full tuition grants regardless of financial status. I was fine with the girl who grew up in a poor neighborhood across the street from the methadone clinic, but when the girl with 2 physician parents got a free ride, and her parents used the money they had saved for tuition to buy her a brand new 1990 Mitsubishi 3000, I really didn't think it was fair. But what do I know...
I graduated from college back when dinosaurs roamed the campus and the cost of college was affordable for my below medium income.parents. I worked as a waitress during the school year - worked during the summers and lived in dorm room whose main luxury was a closet big enough for my sparse collegiate wardrobe.
Nowadays from what I read, students leave their parents ' home for the college experience where they live in luxury with climbing walls, olympic size swimming pools, apartment size dormitory rooms, etc. Someone has to pay for all of this and I expect it is added to everyone's tuitiion and room and board >
I was a single parent and the only way my kids could attend college was to live at home, go to a local community college for their first two years before transferring to the state university for the last two years working as they went. They are both happily employed in decent jobs without student loan debt.
When I went school there were only a few dinosaurs left. My entrance exam was they put a mirror under my nose and if I fogged it, I was in.
They tuition for the whole year was under $1000.00 and that was tuition room and board. My dorm room was unairconditioned. I would buy used books for each course. Some cost as little as 2 dollars. Now books for basic courses can cost over 100 dollars.
College now is a racket.
I tell kids to go to a community college and live at home. Nobody cares where you spent your first two years. It is the last two that count.
be. a plumber. make a ton of cash. be a welder. ditto.. heck. collect garbage. do something that no one else want to do.. make a ton of money. go to night school. study whatever interests you. live a productive life
You've heard from the left over the years that college should be free. This is the first step in going down that road.
Seriously, it starts with this $10K forgiveness. Biden's got two more years, so what's to keep him from bowing to the left again, and wiping out more/all of the remainder.
How do you possibly maintain an underwriting policy after that? How do you charge any student to attend, when the better option is to apply for a loan knowing that it's likely going to be forgiven?
At that point, we've just federalized colleges.
This is either the most ignorant and ill thought out decision made by a President in our nation's history, or the most evil tactic to take over control of our country by the left that's ever been attempted.
I mean, keep in mind this is a bluff. Pelosi has admitted that the President can't unilaterally forgive student loans.
The idea here is that it's a carrot to dangle in front of midterm voters "show up and vote Democrat or else those mean Republicans will take the House and kibosh your loan forgiveness".
It's blatantly illegal, so what will happen is the courts will stop it, Democrats will blame Republican judges for ruining all the fun and turn this into an actual issue, Bob's your uncle.
Every single time, we assume that they couldn’t possibly mean what they say. They will not really do what they propose- it’s all a bluff.
And then, they actually did mean the ridiculous things they say, and they actually do the outrageous things they propose. They get away with it while we are all reassuring ourselves that it’s only a bluff.
I don't know how many people are going to believe it, thought... as we say in the aerospace industry, nothing's real until it comes with a check attached. And there's no way they can get the checks out before the election.
Are you really trying to sell the idea that taxpayers (like plumbers , truck drivers, and waitresses) benefit from the higher levels of education attained by students who major in things like gender studies? And then find that their higher level of education only gets them a job as a barista? So the taxpayers should show proper gratitude and pay for the attainment of this great education?
Please don’t bother with the factoid links- they convince no one.
The people you are talking about already have their education so all the things you talk about are going to happen. Now that they have their education it is time to be responsible and pay back their loans. they took out these loans with their eyes open. They knew the consequences of taking out a loan. Now it is time to act like an adult and pay it back.
Why should I as a taxpayer have to pay back the loans of a bunch of irresponsible leaches?
Then go about it the right way, through Congress. If it is as society-improving and noble as you say, it should be a popular issue and no problem to pass - especially with a D majority in the Senate.
Right, the Right will just answer with their own bonanza giveaway.
I borrowed $8000 through 1994 and by 2014, after literally twenty years of paying $250 per month, still owed ***$12,000.*** This was before the predatory lending habits of colleges really set in. My husband and I were glad to refinance our home in 2020 to take care of this debt (and others) - that part of our refinance is already paid off, and we didn't have to try very hard.
So I'm super sympathetic to people getting absolutely abused by college loans, but I think the answer is - just cancel it. No repayment, just sorry, guys - we're cancelling all the interest over 3% on student debt, retroactively and permanently. Tell all the colleges with huge endowments they have to pay it. Stop the problem as well as offering a solution. This is a bad solution but better than what Biden just gave us.
I kind of get that. A lot of students were sold down the river, with promises of "get a degree, any degree, and you'll pull down a six-figure job at graduation." I just don't appreciate when I point out that I paid off my student loan, and I also worked to get through school, and the Millennial response is "sucks to be you".
Nothing wrong with the universities according to the left...they're doing exactly as purposed. And debt "forgiveness" (i.e.; transfer) is the perfect way to energize and embolden them even more. They can now say: "Look! We got our enemies to actually PAY for everything we're doing!!! More please!"
John hit it on the head. I understand the problem it's trying to solve, but this "student loan forgiveness" plan just feels a little banana-republic-ish. In Latin America the politicians don't even bother trying to hide that they're buying votes; this feels the same.
Jon, you say: “If the student loan vote purchasing scam actually happens, it will set a new precedent in election politics that will be the beginning of our country’s death spiral.” the definition of a scam is: to deceive and defraud: (to deprive of something by deception) there is no deceiving or deception here, it’s in front of God and everybody.
Nearly 90% of those receiving relief earn less than $75,000 a year. Democrats are helping out the average worker, not the rich. What really upset you is there might be a bunch of folks who vote for a Democrat because a politician actually helps them!
My daughter, who is in her 2nd yr of law school and who just got a job offer at the equivalent of $140k just got 2/3 of all her student debt wiped out.
How you ask?
Well, she worked all the way through college and still managed to graduate in 3 yrs, Phi Bets Kappa, with a degree in neuroscience and a minor in economics from Virginia Tech. Got some small scholarships but mostly she paid for it herself. Then she earned a full ride to law school.
Her entire debt after 2 yrs of law school, because she has worked and saved was only $16k. Biden just wiped out $10k because she is still a student and has not yet started her career. That $140k will start next year.
SO....she will walk out of law school making $140k with only about $10k in debt for her entire education. She can pay that off in 6 months.
And precisely WHY should we have to ask taxpayers to cover the stupid decisions of others?
If you went to college and got a degree in literature or XXX Studies, and then realized that the only jobs you were gonna get were in academia but for that you need a doctorate, and then blow $100k in loans to get a job paying $50K as an adjunct, that is YOUR stupid fault.
If you went to college for a degree in social work and spent $80 grand to do it without considering that the best you could hope to earn when you graduate is $40k, then you are a MORON.
SO yeah, I got an issue with covering people who make stupid decisions. I have an issue with throwing people money, even my daughter, who just got lucky and who are heading to be in the top 10% of earners in their early 20's. I got an issue with people who are unwilling to do what my daughter did, work through school, during school, full time on breaks, never went on trips or Spring Break, skipped to social scene at college,but busted her ass and started saving for college with summer jobs as a 15 yr old.
I got an issue with people who borrow stupid amounts of money on a hope when I had to enlist to qualify as independent for financial aid and serve 4 yrs to earn the GI Bill. I got an issue with people who do that and go to the school they dream of and not the one they can afford, the way I did. I could have gone to BC or Northeastern, Amherst, but I chose a small state college because it was affordable. I worked almost full time while carrying a full load. Sure, it took me 5 yrs instead of 4, but I graduated with $2,500 in debt and walked into a job paying $33k a year. That was 1994.
I got an issue with people who are too IGNORANT to realize that college is a business decision. Where you go, when you go, how you go is all about ONE thing, getting out with a useful education and the piece of paper to prove it, with the absolute minimal amount of cost and as close to no debt as you can pull off. People who borrow a ton of money on degrees with no immediate return and who go for the college experience, get what their stupidity deserves.
All great points. It seems to me that the people who complain the most about student debt are the ones whose choices resulted in debt they couldn’t afford to pay back. I think it’s difficult for most people to admit they may have made some poor choices and that they may have to live with the consequences. Guess what? Sometimes life isn’t fair and nothing is owed to anyone, ever. You work your ass off and sometimes shitty things still happen. That sucks.
we don’t change everything to help people that made bad decisions or had no foresight. We could change the way people can borrow. Maybe make it different process to begin with idk. But yes, everyone that signs up for those loans is responsible to pay them back and if you’re not bright enough to really examine what goes into the process in the present as well as the future, well you sort of get what comes to you. It’s not our burden to bare imo.
While getting my hair cut yesterday, my Polish immigrant stylist was updating me on her kids. Her 18 yo son just entered an electrician apprenticeship program because she can't afford to help pay for his college and does not want him to be saddled with so much debt. Her older daughter completed law school and she helped as much as she could. So now, with this absurd wealth transfer, the 18 yo will be paying for help the older sister/lawyer pay off some of her debt! I suggested her son should negotiate with his sister to provide free legal services in exchange.
To be fair, I blame a lot of people beyond just these borrowers, who, in large part, were just teens when they started borrowing.
1. I blame parents who do not take the time to teach their kids to look at college as a business investment but instead tell them to get into the best school they can and figure out how to pay for it. I blame parents who do not take the time to teach their kids financial literacy, to help them understand the long term financial consequences of their choices in school, how they pay for it, and what that looks like AFTER graduation. I blame them for telling these kids that they can be anything they want without consideration of what that means in terms of life style after school.
2. I blame HS teachers and guidance counselors for insisting to every single kid that they MUST attend college and they MUST do it right away after graduation. There are a lot of good choices in trades and other careers that either do not require a degree or if the career might require one it is not necessary to have it completed until your either ready to move into some form of management or to start your own business. You can go make a pretty penny as an airline mechanic, take management courses at night over a number of years at a community college, then move up into management if that is what you want. There are LOADS of jobs in IT where all you have to do is take a couple of training courses, get a couple of certifications, and walk into a job paying $70k. Toss in some classes at night, and you can move up nicely and be making 6 figures in 5 or 6 yrs.
3. I blame the universities who pitch their services with slick advertising to HS juniors. They sell the "experience" of going to their school. Anyone who has actually attended college knows that after the first semester anyone with any sense is just working to get that paper and get out. The "college experience" is not real for most people after that and it is a very very expensive luxury.
I blame all of the above for not teaching kids that when they look at a college or a major the first thing they need to ask themselves is "What kind of job is this going to lead to?" followed immediately by "What is the market for those jobs and how much do they pay to start?".
We have GOT to STOP selling kids on college as the golden ticket or an absolute necessity. We have GOT to STOP telling them they should follow their dreams and embrace the college experience. NO....NO...NO......College is a SERIOUS business decision with a huge price tag and we are lying and manipulating and selling it to 17 yr olds to get them to go without helping them to see the consequences of their choices or really letting them know what all their choices are.
"If you went to college for a degree in social work and spent $80 grand to do it without considering that the best you could hope to earn when you graduate is $40k, then you are a MORON." As a retired educator, who left college with a $5,000 loan (which was actually very hard to pay off at the great salary of $8900 -- but I did), I had to chuckle when I learned that my nephew's now wife got her elementary education degree at Vanderbilt University. Thing is, her dad is a doctor, so she has no student loans but if her parents hadn't paid for it, she likely wouldn't have a degree from Vanderbilt. Parents are also MORONS for the absurdity of a degree that costs more than the salary from that degree.
Oh...your reading comprehension skills are off. Must be a recent grad.
No, what I am saying is that nobody is entitled to go to the college of their dream right out of HS and expect to do nothing but focus on studies and the "college experience".
I am saying that nobody is entitled to go spend stupid money on a worthless degree because it interests them or inspires them unless they are willing to write the check.
College and getting a college degree is a BUSINESS decision, not a personal growth one.
You want to borrow $90k on an engineering degree from MIT? Maybe that is a good business investment.
You want to borrow $90k to get a doctorate in Sociology from Florida State? Maybe not so smart.
College is too expensive and takes too much time to think of it as anything but a business choice.
Maybe you have to enlist to qualify as independent and get the GI Bill as I did.
Maybe you got to work multiple jobs or even a full time job and take 5 yrs to graduate.
Maybe you go get a trade, work full time and string together enough classes at night over a decade to get a degree.
What you ABSOLUTELY DO NOT DO, is go to a school where you are going to have to borrow so much money that you are going to be destitute for a decade.
You absolutely do NOT pick a degree that leads to jobs with very narrow career options and those career options are all low paying.
You pick the school you can most easily afford, you work as much as you can to pay as you go, you scrap for every scholarship you can, you do not party, you do not take trips, you work and you study and pick a degree that will give you a track toward a higher paying career.
College is an investment. Nothing more. You want to maximize your return.
The American Dream...is largely gone. Those with the energy and determination to really hustle can sometimes still find it. But many of the paths to securing a middle-class life that were still being sold to my generation (Gen-X), ended up being dead ends in the wilderness. In many cases, the paths had been shut down because of the way the Boomers abused them.
Nor does it help that inflation (particularly real estate inflation) has made it more and more difficult for young people to find housing they can afford. My husband and I managed to avoid this largely by moving where the real estate was affordable. But that is becoming less and less of an option.
But the central premise of the American Dream--the part where our founding principals are the key to being free to seek the life we want for ourselves--has been destroyed by the Left's utter denigration of America. They hate our history. They hate our Constitution. They hate the Western values that allowed us to become a bastion of freedom. When America is a place that can only be hated, what room is there for an American Dream?
The American Dream persists in the immigrants who come to this country.
I have reconsidered my view on immigration. I want more Legal Immigration because we can “rob” bad countries of their intellectual capital, and because Americans aren’t having 2.1 babies per family. These legal immigrants become net contributors to America practically immediately. But I still oppose the flood of illegals over the border that burden our communities and serve the cartels, bringing drugs and crime.
Well said. As a legal immigrant who had my oath ceremony just yesterday to become a naturalized US citizen I couldn’t agree more with you. Those of us who have lived in other countries, including reasonably wealthy western nations, know how great this country is if you are willing to apply yourself. Unfortunately many of those lucky enough to be born here, fail to recognize their great fortune.
Thank you, I truly appreciate your faith in me. But I especially appreciate you imagining I’ll be a “great” American. Those are big shoes to fill. I assure you I’ve tried over 33 years of living in this wonderful country, and even though I’ve had to leave it many times for work commitments, to impart to others how very fortunate we are to Iive here. Some refuse to see it. Usually they are those who were born here. What they don’t see is, you never fully appreciate freedom until you lose it.
So true. My daughter who is a civil engineering major was in Guatemala last week with Engineers Without Borders. They were building a water distribution center to bring clean water up to the mountainous area where the people are living and currently have no access to clean water. She's 21 and her comment on returning was, "I needed this more than they needed me."
One of the probing questions their faculty advisor asked (which occurred each evening) was "if five fingers on one hand could each produce a liquid what would those five liquids be." All of the student volunteers said water, of course, but when the local builder who worked with the group took his turn, he said "hot water".
We take SO much for granted. We are so 1st world that we have time to think about flipping pronouns while other struggle to get clean or hot water!
Thank you for that, and thank you to your wonderful daughter for her willingness to help, she gives us all hope. You clearly raised her well.
One thing I’ve always told people on my journey when they have tried to denigrate America and only focus on its faults; Yes, it’s true it has faults, but it’s the spirit of America that everyone clamors for. Some say they hate America, and yet they want to be just like it!
We know this from people beating down the door to come here. Not too many other countries (who? 🤷♀️) where that happens. Not even Australia where they’ve reverted to paying people and their passage to immigrate.
Now, can that change, when as you say pronouns are the main focus, no. People will still want to come here. But not for the right reasons I fear.
We need a pause. We need everyone in America to learn the language, the history, and the culture. We need old timers and new comers to love and revere our country and it’s principles.
Yes the distinction between "legal" and "illegal" is essential in the immigration debate. We need immigrants, but we cannot exist as a nation if we don't have controlled, limited immigration.
What I can never understand is those who say they care for illegal immigrants trying to make a better life for themselves and their families, yet they refuse to see the egregious abuse heaped on these poor souls by coyotes among others when coming here illegally. Why can they not see their “caring” is doing nothing but fueling this evil and filling the pockets of the swines doing the abuse. I can only conclude it’s cognitive dissonance on the part of these people, and they are almost entirely left wing and Democrats.
It has been the habit of Democrats for a long time to talk and talk and talk about compassion, but to institute policies that, while seemingly "kind" on the surface, actually lead to horrible outcomes.
YES! I'll take lots of skilled, legal immigrants. I might suggest a special Visa program for high-tech Taiwanese workers. What better way to build a semiconductor industry than to poach existing talent? And there's probably a lot of that talent that would love to escape the hot breath of the neighboring totalitarian gorilla. That's just an idea and in the end, I don't care where they come from as long as they're ready to embrace Western culture.
But I'm tired of being told I'm racist for not wanting poor, central Americans with no skills to wade across the Rio Grande and be welcomed with open arms by our elites who want cheap gardeners, roofers, and nannies, to the detriment of the most vulnerable of our fellow citizens who must compete for those very jobs.
I agree. Almost every legal immigrant I encounter is more American at heart than most post-Gen-X Americans. I would like to see a program where countries who send immigrants here would have to accept a certain number of America-haters who want nothing more than to leave in exchange. So many of the America-haters have discovered that other countries have much higher immigration standards than America does, and will not take them.
If I may, I'd like to push back against the generic 'Boomers' reference when addressing the abuse claim. Democrats, during the Boomer years, controlled the House for 40 years, and passed countless bills, against Republican wishes, that led to where we are today. The history of Democrats using federal dollars to buy votes goes way back, and is on display, in a shameless and unprecedented way, with the loan forgiveness scam.
So, it wasn't a 'Boomer' issue, imho, it was a 'New Deal' issue that spun out of control.
I'm a Boomer. I think we inherited the greatest nation in human history from our parents, "The Greatest Generation." We passed on to the next generation a smoking ruin.
The mistake we made in the late 50s, 60s and 70s was thinking that the prosperity we were enjoying by being the only nation who's manufacturing infrastructure was not damaged after WWII, was going to last, even after the rest of the world rebuilt. We started writing checks (mostly on endowments) that we would ultimately not be able to cash.
I, a 69-year-old Boomer, am always telling my 26-year-old daughter: “Sorry, sweetheart, but you’ve really been screwed by my generation and all because we could never say “no.”
I'm not talking about problems caused by Boomers in government; this happened well before then. I'm talking about the behavior of Boomers in their youth that caused older generations to stop giving young people a hand up. No one trusted young people anymore, thanks to the Boomers. A great many policies changed as a result of Boomer behavior.
Celia, I’m a Boomer (later phase, not old enough for Woodstock) who thinks that most of the ideas from my youth were a bunch of BS. As I’ve grown older I do wonder - where the hell were the adults back then?
The university presidents were kissing the asses of the students who demanded that students should make all the rules.
Look at pictures of political leaders from the 70’s. They grew their hair a little longer and tried to be cool, to court the youth vote. Ted Kennedy and Gary Hart come to mind, but they all did it to some extent.
Media and advertisers fell all over themselves catering to the crazy ideas of the young. Very few stood up to it in any way- the adults were trying to be just as cool as the kids. That only made the kids disrespect them more.
The last vestiges of the generation of adults that tried so hard to make the kids like them? They are the octogenarians like Biden and Pelosi that run things now. Finally they are as cool as the kids.
Where were the adults? They were overwhelmed by teenagers. Until the Boomers, there was no such thing. Vogue figured out that teens had money. Commerce found it was money they could easily get by pandering to the youth movement.
Sex, drugs, and rock 'n roll followed. I don't think the adults had muchuva chance against the onslaught. I dunno, but imagine they were somewhat shell-shocked by the Depression and WWII, and just couldn't fathom their kids activities.
It was a trying time, and I'm sure many parents were overwhelmed. But what really strikes me now, looking back on it all, is how many 40ish adults tried so hard to dress and act like 20 year olds. Nothing more pathetic than adults who try to be just like the cool kids, and many did just that. Boomers didn't originate refusing to grow up - it was the generation before us.
Edit: Maybe I'm just mad that they foisted "adult contemporary" music on us. They were 100% responsible for Air Supply 😕
Democrats didn't strangle housing construction to drive up the price of existing homes (so now houses that boomers bought 40 years ago for $50k are now worth $800k).
As a legal immigrant for years and now a naturalized US citizen as of yesterday, I say to you do what Americans have always done. Fight back. Not physically, but ideologically. If you aren’t already doing so, talk about how much you love America, its history (recognizing its warts of course), its western values, the constitution, and tout the American Dream as a reality. The Dream will only die if Americans themselves kill it. Don’t let that happen is my suggestion to you as a newly formed US citizen. Defeat the hate with love. Please.
It is alive. Only way to kill it is to give up on it. Hold the line and stand your ground. The determination that got you to the US will carry you through. Believe in yourself and America and we’ll all be better off for it.
Well, I’d say its less about gold (immigrants generally aren’t looking for an easy life) and more about being able to have a go at starting something new. Entrepreneurial ideas and innovation have oozed out of America in abundance for decades, and the world has benefited. In Europe we have an attitude when something’s broken or needs improving you’ll hear, “The government should get on that”. In America if something’s broken or needs fixing, you’ll more likely hear, “How can we do that”. If you lose that attitude, then what? So good luck getting your road paved. Begin now perhaps, with a new attitude.
No, not at all. For me it was always about freedom to be myself and to live my life the way I want and not how my socialist government planned it. It took me long and hard years to get out. Thank G-d I was young and happy to start my life from scratch, from the very bottom. Ours is a rich country, so with success comes a level of comfort in life, no doubt, but it was never about “streets paved with gold”, and I know many who feel the same. This is a perilous time for the western culture. And yea, many roads need to be paved and bridges repaired. We got distracted by culture wars!
I feel the same way, TxFrog! The streets in our little town get worse and worse, while the wealthy idiots who run the show spend money on their own pet projects.
Our 1st house in WA state was $42,500, new construction, in 1977. We bought it with a VA loan. My dad saw it for sale a few years ago and checked the price - $399,000
The behavior of Boomers resulted in older generations having less trust and respect for young people. Policies got changed due to Boomers.
For example, It was much harder to find a job in 1985 than back in 1965. Instead of talking to the boss about a job, soulless job applications handled by HR became the norm.
Thanks to the feminist Boomers seeking Yuppie careers, housewives and stay-at-home-moms--the favored norm in the 60s--were looked down on as worthless in the 80s and 90s.
Pretty much everything that we Gen-Xers sought to do, we found that Boomers had already been there and wrecked.
Celia, the American dream for 90% of people, is rarely attainable, but for the 10% who run The Present Day capitalistic system, the American dream is doing just fine!
Colleges are a racket and they are a racket backstopped and fed by the federal government.
Tuition today is INSANE and it can only BE insane for two reasons, demand and lots of funding. If fewer kids wanted to go to college and even fewer had the money to pay for it, tuitions would not be where they are.
1. Employers have made a college degree a necessity for even the most basic entry level position.
2. We have told kids that the ONLY path to success is through going right to college.
3. Societally, we have created a social structure where those with college degrees (the more expensive the better) are considered to sit higher on the social pecking order.
4. We have made funding this so so much easier with federally backed loans.
In short, we created astronomical DEMAND for a college degree while pumping huge amounts of secured money at colleges.
And, what are we getting for this? Academia is a mess. Most professors are chasing tenure and doing what it requires to get it. Generally, that does not mean TEACHING, it means publishing and attending conferences. TAs and Adjuncts teach, when they teach. So nobody is really providing the education we are supposedly paying for.
Worse, when they ARE teaching, they too often engage in pedagogy, concerned more with passing on the social mores of a very left wing academic culture than assuring kids learn their subjects and develop skills.
Throw in the fact that because colleges are a racket, out to make money for the administrators and tenured professors etc, they see students as customers and keeping the customer happy and willing to pay is the number one priority. SO, schools cater to the whims of 17 yr olds and lower standards.
Agree! And here’s another infuriating thing about academics—-they get to have consulting contracts for thousands of dollars a day while also collecting their fat university paychecks. They double dip, everyone knows it, and no one cares. And they can dump their consulting work on their graduate students who get paid nothing for the work. Ask me how I know this….
I did not mention that but I should have. OH....I DO know.
I had a tenured professor at Stanford do some work for a client of mine. He billed them $1,300 an hour for over 3 yrs. Did I mention this was a federal client? His grad students and recently graduated grad students worked for him. He billed the government $350 pr/hr for the recent grads but you know he sure as heck was not paying them that.
Heck, I remember my economics professor in college. He was tenured but was also a practicing attorney locally.
These adjuncts today, they can do alright if they have consulting gigs. The ones that suffer are the fools who teach things like Literature or XXX Studies. Nobody needs them to consult. But if you have something in tech, the sciences, engineering, math, economics etc., you can make a bundle consulting.
Yet we do need PhDs in American literature such as today’s guest writer/editor, Nick Gillespie, who did a brilliant job distilling the week’s news. He wrote some great memorable lines, such as Biden making everyone forget about inflation.
We do not need the numbers we are producing. Nor do we need to be charging what we do to get a degree with limited career options. PhDs in literature are primarily geared to teach but we have too many of them and when they DO get jobs in academia they end up spending most of their time chasing tenure writing essays and research papers on increasingly inane topics that are designed to appeal to their peers social positions.
What we NEED is more people with solid critical thinking skills, problem solving skills, with good math and communications skills. THATs what we need more of, across the board.
You are so right. The vast majority of college graduates have a degree in business administration. What the h—l is that? They have no clue upon graduation either. Meanwhile, Biden is throwing billions to fund chip manufacturing in the US. Do we have people with expertise? The administration does not care. Throwing money to the wind is what they are good at. It turns out there is only a handful of schools in the US that prepare semiconductor engineers, and we have 10 times less of them than we need because number of people majoring in electric engineering has plummeted in recent years. It is hard! Why bother when a youngster can major in nothing burger of “business administration”.
Employers made a college degree a requisite because the k-12 education system has deteriorated to the point that a high school diploma does not mean a candidate is capable of reading, writing, and doing basic math.
The teachers unions destroyed our k-12 system, and the perceived saint Jimmy Carter sold out to them, creating the education department to pay back their political support.
Anne, thats not why we did it, and I am somebody who hires 40 plus people a year.
We did it to weed out resume's. It used to be that I would get 50-100 resumes for a single position. I do not have the time to weed through that many and neither do my recruiters. The answer to that was to keep jacking up the education requirements to weed out people.
Is there something to what you say? Sure, but hell, even most college grads today are better at social activism than basic algebra and cannot write anything more complex than a tweet. God, the writing skills of your average college grad today are awful. Never mind their reading comprehension, they do not have the attention span for it, they need things spoon fed to them.
This is great. I was going to comment along these lines, but there’s no need. You articulated everything I’ve been thinking and saying for the past decade. I am a product of the times when high schools were actively scrapping vocational programs and the options post-graduation were generally presented as college or failure. The liberal arts university I attended from 2006-2010 was doing their level best to go woke (while pick-pocketing anyone and everyone) even back then. Fortunately I had a lot of well-grounded family, friends, and teachers growing up, so I was at least immune to these efforts. I’m not their target clientele, though.
This is well said, that employers are a large part of the problem. When you need a 4 year degree for anything above "fry cook", do we wonder that the demand for a 4 year degree, any at all, has skyrocketed? Regardless of whether the 4 year degree has any relationship to the job demanding it?
I work in IT. The bulk of technical skills can be self taught via online courses, or even in person boot camps to get the basics. The actual job skills come from on the job experience though. No course is going to teach in-house proprietary systems and business logic and in house processes. That requires on the job learning and training, which corporations must learn that they need to get back in the business of doing. Hiring with the expectations of training and promoting within, with careful strategies of seeding in new talent for new ideas and methodologies along the way.
There's a lot of "professional" jobs that don't require necessarily a 4 year degree - what it has substituted for is a "certification" of achievement that the employer has some basis to believe the applicant has committed to a program of achievement, committment to goals, etc. But these markers can be found in alternatives - certifications, prior job history, skills assessments, etc.
And yet - I don't want to discount the value of a general liberal arts degree in general. Having foundations in a broad based educational background is of course also beneficial - we don't also just want a world run by one tracked savant engineers focused solely on delivering technical efficiencies either. So it should be balanced as to the qualifications at perhaps differening levels of the career. And here's where corporations can also serve - pay for the "well rounded" educations for promising up and comers to fill those higher seats, on the corp's dollars. Corporations have too long demanded a highly educated and highly skilled workforce while externalizing the investments for that on to the public, and then crying for H1B Visas when they can't find their purple unicorns (and are not also getting those purple unicorns via H1B either).
Yes, well said. One of the consequences of this is that there are too many graduates with degrees that do not have value in the marketplace. Classic overproduction. And the schools suffer no economic consequences of this because they are insulated by the government. A total farce.
Here's my personal take on the loan forgiveness. As a result of capitalized interest, I owe more on my student loans than our total gross worth. I found out, too late, that the career I so desperately wanted (to be a professor of English) was not open to me because I am not--nor was I willing to pretend to be--a Far Left Wokie.
So, for me, $20,000 in loan forgiveness is meaningless. A mere fraction of what I owe, and will never, ever be able to afford to pay back.
For me, the ability to discharge student loans in bankruptcy--after a certain number of years and a clear inability to pay--is the only solution that would help. And it would help all the others who are drowning in unpayable student loans...*without* giving handouts to people with six-figure incomes.
Oh, the capitalized interest! I wonder if people realize that student loans are pretty much the only debt where they’re allowed to do that. Both a mortgage and a car loan have a simple interest plan only. The student loan industry is really quite a racket. The mob would be so proud!
my student loan has about doubled the amount I originally borrowed. And I've been paying it all along. What a scam. Of course they can do that knowing you can't discharge it. They'll take it from your Social Security if it goes that long!
I went to college decades ago, to inexpensive state universities, had part time jobs, and only needed $13k student loan, which I paid off in maybe 4 yrs. I never got, nor needed counseling on the loan because I was in a scientific field and my earning expectations were good. So here are my questions—-how do the universities and lenders rationalize lending students so much money? Do they have any responsibility for what they are doing? Shouldn’t there be some sort of counselor helping students understand the earnings potential of different degrees vs their loan payments? It seems criminal to make it so easy to saddle kids with debts, but it’s also unacceptable to forgive their loans. Landscapers who never went to college but pay taxes are paying off those loans.
It's very close to child abuse. These kids aren't in a position to fully understand the magnitude of the decisions they're making, that only benefit the lending institutions, the colleges and the Democrat party.
The problem is that colleges do *nothing* to help students consider whether they will be able to get jobs that will allow them to repay the loan. No questions are asked about your major. No information is given about the prospects of future employment.
And it doesn't matter to the university, because they have the money, and they have ZERO responsibility for what happens to the students in the future. There is no incentive to counsel students.
Colleges take no responsibility. They allow students to believe that OF COURSE they will be able to get a job that will allow them to pay off their loan. In many cases, they know that is unlikely to be true, but that doesn't stop them.
Agree totally. I believe that allowing young people to take on ridiculous amounts of debt, without fully appreciating the risk, and not allowing the debt to be eligible for bankruptcy is criminal. It's evidence of what the real intention of the student loan program is, a troika of Lending institutions. Universities and the federal government to promote an agenda at the cost of the tax payers.
I worked at the Student Accounts department of a well-ranked private university - I can confirm that my department treated these loans like Monopoly money. They were part of the “aid package “ (a laughable term)
It is horrifying that student loans can be for more than books, tuition, and room and board. The equivalency would be a car loan that would cover the cost of the car, insurance, along with a provision for gas and entertainment costs.
Oi, that sucks : ( Well I graduated with a BS in IT degree (ultimately from a private for profit - the only one doing online courses at the time when I had a baby and could do course work at night after part time work and baby time), that finished up the degree on top of the two years of credits I accumulated from "regular" community college and state u a few years prior but hadn't completed. And I am, thankfully, in renumerative work from that degree and am nothing more than thankful for where it got me.
But.. man, can I tell you that the private loans I had to take out for the private for profit finisher about doubled in 10 years from what I had originally borrowed. And I am paying them back but had to take periods of deferrment for income reasons, but still. Double what I borrowed? Seems insane.
Agree bankruptcy should be reintroduced to student loans - with the caveat that defaulted loans get pushed back on the school. If they didn't provide a degree that was able to be repay the money they put into their pockets when it was disbursed, they should own some of that. But I also think the interest capitalizing on student loans needs a review as well. Because that's probably a huge component as to why some loans are not repayable. They're doubling, tripling, even when you're making the "minimum" payment and doing your due diligence to repay, but it's set up to take much more than you ever borrowed - and this should not be treated like revolving consumer credit interest charging. There should be a flat interest fee that is calculated against the original principle, and that's it.
I'm finally on a path to full repayment but it does grind my gears that I spent years paying interest when the interest continued to capitalize. Yes I get that's how "interest" works but even my mortgage is fairer than how they charged interest with the student loans. Of course knowing you can't declare bankruptcy, why would they do any different?
Oh, the universities benefit vastly from the system exactly the way it is, so they have no incentive to change anything, and every incentive to raise tuition as often as they can get away with it.
There is something really rotten with loan forgiveness. The left ignores and dismisses this point , but it is unequivocally unfair to people who study real disciplines and get real jobs and pay their loans.
Although I do see a problem with the loan complex. At 18 years old you really don’t understand the economics of the burden. There has to be a better way. Perhaps a simple solution is to require students pursue a real major? Happy for the taxpayers to risk capital on potential engineers, but these liberal studies are terrible in so many ways. Most of these kids just show up at college and “take classes” with no real dedication to an investment in skill development.
The better way is to get the federal government out of the process and let financial institutions and universities accept the risk for the debt. Let the universities decide whether a $100K loan for a 'whatever' studies degree is worth the risk of default.
The college industry needs to be disconnected from our federal government as we've created a progressive indoctrination program that's being subsidized by hundreds of billions of taxpayer dollars. Tuition costs have risen at six times the inflation rate, while the product has become less valuable. That only happens with federal intervention.
The student loan approval process has divorced itself from actual actuarial science and approved loans that aren't based on risk, but according to the benefit of the Universities, or the progressive movement, while putting the taxpayers at risk.
Thanks for the link. Good comments. Any party not wholly owned by the professional-managerial class could implement his idea of putting schools on the hook for graduates whose degrees aren't worth anything economically. Right now, only 1 party appears even close to "not owned by the PMC", but you never know.
I agree, the system we have now is flooding the market with skills that are not needed, classic overproduction. But the producer, the schools, are insulated by the government from the economic risks of what they are doing. A cluster fuck for sure.
I say put the credit risk on the schools. Make them assess the student’s potential to repay. This will reduce the production worthless degrees as well as reduce tuition prices. It will also shrink the pie, less students going to college and some poorly run schools going belly up, which would be good for the overall quality of the system.
Well said and so true! The “endowments” of many of these universities are staggering! It’s criminal that they are not only tax exempt, but also that they are allowed to sit on that kind of money, acting as hedge funds (and pushing ESG, I’m sure). That money should be required by law to be used to fund, among other things, student scholarships and loans. Period.
Correct. Schools need to assume responsibility for the loan money they are currently receiving in full, up front, while they have zero stake in the game for its repayment. This has incentivized schools to drive up costs that the loans have to increase to meet, and they walk away with the money, while the student (aka "vehicle for the money") is stuck with all the risk and responsibility.
I'm a Democrat, but I opposed this "forgiveness" program because it does nothing to address the larger issues but issue a one time band-aid for those already stuck with the consequences. It should have come witsh more strings attached for institutions - both lenders and educational institutions - to bear the ultimate risks for defaults, to incentivize driving down costs and issuing loans on the supply side. And frankly, employers need to be reined in as well on their hiring requirements. If they demand 4 year degrees for everything above "fry cook" then they need to be spending the money to provide for that workforce.
It’s hard to turn back the clock on a system that has allowed universities to raise tuition with no consequences for decades. It’s become a dog chasing its tail. The government should have never taken on loan guarantees - the universities needed to have some skin in the game. Not sure how to go back now.
Reduce demand. The world needs doctors, lawyers, engineers, and teachers (I’m sure the list can be expanded a bit), and those folks probably need a higher education. Most vocations don’t require it (even if those in the given vocation think that they do). Universities are businesses, and they turn out a lot of garbage products. Stop buying.
Are you better off with a four-year degree in business or four years of sales experience? With a four-year degree in literature or four years as a working newspaper reporter? With a four-year degree in music or four years of playing gigs? With the exception of physical sciences, math, engineering and medicine, I think most college degrees are a poor investment. Maybe law, but then do we really need to subsidize more lawyers?
Historically, university degrees were never supposed to be an economic "investment" at all. They are supposed to be for the brightest and most gifted to study the best ideas in the history of the world with the goal of becoming a more virtuous person who might have a few original thoughts in the course of his lifetime and maybe be able to use one of them to improve the world in some small way.
Where we went wrong was allowing our corporations to talk us into converting our universities into job training centers. We had apprenticeship programs and internships for that, but big companies like it better when someone else (taxpayer or student) picks up the tab for their future employees' training.
Other than a few small schools, there's almost no one who actually teaches "the liberal arts" anymore, as in the study of the best ideas in the history of the world. Over the last decade, Hillsdale College has largely become the Harvard of classical school families for exactly this reason.
Simple: just set a degree-wide loan limit = average amount a person with your major makes three years after graduation. The kicker is that a person with a gender studies degree may be flipping burgers or brewing coffee. Those get averaged in as well. Can’t limit the wages just to the 7 people who find jobs studying gender.
Don't fool yourself. Every government agency and most corporations now have diversity, equity and inclusion departments with jobs for "studies" majors. They are well-paid obstacles to productivity.
Turn college loan policy back to the states and get it out of the federal government.. Most states would divorce themselves from the process, while Cali would guarantee all undocumented migrants 6 years of free tuition. But the ultimate solution is to get the feds out of that business.
During high school my son was the high school loan officer. He loaned money to selected students at 30% interest calculated weekly. We didn’t know at the time but we taught all our kids about finance and prudence, and all are financially stable adults.
He had hundreds of dollars in cash around his room when he left home because he understood the concept of delayed/denied gratification.
If an eighteen year old is ignorant of basic financial concepts that’s on the parents.
I've read through a lot of comments bemoaning loan forgiveness and making suggestions for dealing with debt. Not one person has suggested that students take a year or two to work and save money while living with their parents.
A diligent young person can save enough to cover the first two years' tuition, and co-op jobs can cover the rest. Why does higher education need to follow high school immediately?
The one-two years of work is a good idea for maturity and focus to be able to complete a four year degree in four years. Bless the heart of the student who assumes the luxury of dithering and being unfocused in college and needing 6 years or more to leave with loads of debt and no degree, because they will get bitten on their backside by loan repayment. It is also equally absurd that many universities do not guarantee that they will offer the classes needed to allow a student enrolled in a four year program to succeed in graduating in four years.
How many students pay that out of pocket? At least students from lower income families. And who borrows $75 K per year for education that doesn't lead to similarly gainful employment?
There are plenty of students from wealthy families who pay these exhorbitant amounts for useless degrees. Students from families that didn't throw money around tend to get scholarships that cover most of the tuition.
• Private tuition, fees, room and board per year: $2,930 (inflation adjusted: $18,140)
• Public tuition, fees, room and board per year: $1,410 (inflation adjusted: $8,730)
• Adults with a bachelor's degree: 11.4%
2017
• Private tuition, fees, room and board per year: $46,990 (inflation adjusted: $48,380)
• Public tuition, fees, room and board per year: $20,790 (inflation adjusted: $21,400)
• Adults with a bachelor's degree: 34.2%
That's what the combination of the federal student loan and the "everyone goes to college" mindset has made. And outside of engineering, does anyone really think the education these kids are getting today is superior to that of 50 years ago?
I've heard a proposal to make loan amount commensurate with predicted income based on a student's chosen major major. Engineering? Maximum allowable, as this major predicts high income after completion. Gender studies (or any other major that leads to jobs involving fry oil and a small hat)? Minimum allowable, because that loan will never be paid. This might also return students to considering value rather than fads when it comes to higher education.
When gender studies, literature, philosophy, etc. is the educational domain of only the privileged few with trust funds that can afford to attend universities and not be concerned about a salary after years of expensive study then what is the result? Perhaps it is the current group of professors that are teaching at many universities who talk about social justice from gated communities; who understand that there is a need for John Kerry to use a private jet and their children to attend private schools; or can condemn an innocent baker of racism and accept a colleague that planned a genocide. Maybe, a few intellectuals "do you want fries with that" and saw the struggle and pride of their parents' hard work would bring a much needed honesty and evaluation to the "studies."
We need to construct and fund an educational system that heeds John W Gardner's advice when he wrote, " The society which scorns excellence in plumbing because plumbing is a humble activity, and tolerates shoddiness in philosophy because it is an exalted activity, will have neither good plumbing nor good philosophy. Neither its pipes nor its theories will hold water.”
Just a word of caution, engineering is made of of different fields, such as civil, mechanical, electrical and aerospace. There are employment booms and busts in those fields, and the curriculum in each is remarkably different.
The sign held by the young person on the left shows what we taxpayers got for paying his tuition: a love of dictatorship, zero rationality, and an inability to spell.
"poorer borrowers able to walk away from twice as much"
This phrasing is somewhat misleading. The $20,000 for borrowers who received Pell grants - "poorer borrowers," strictly speaking - means they had lower incomes at the time they attended college. It does not mean they are "poorer" now than other beneficiaries of this debacle or "poorer" than people without student loan debt.
I am a perfect example of this point. I started college late and was not a dependent and got a pell grant. Worked hard and my kids won't qualify for much of anything other than using the money we've saved for their education. We've covered pretty much all of it - probably too much. But, with inflation going as it is, it probably still won't be enough. Shrug - well, the ingrates ;-) need to have some skin in the game anyway...
We expect our children to go to college cheaply, community college followed by the local state university branch, or pay for their own college by joining the military, for example. Second son got Pell grants for a couple of years.
An excellent point. I was a "poorer borrower" in 1990, with a salary of 13K. My first job, in 2000, paid $175K. Should I not have been responsible for my debt? (Just to be clear, I paid it all off.)
Aug 26, 2022Liked by Nick Gillespie, Nellie Bowles
Thank you Nick for the round up. TGIF is one of my must reads and a highlight of my week. It is great to see the quality remains while Nellie is on maternity leave.
And because I was acclaimed a few weeks ago to do a sort of foreign correspondent's type (and it amuses me) here is this week's:
This is Northumberland UK calling 19 8 22
Guilt through familial connection has come for the noted abolitionist Edmund Burke. His brother apparently was involved in the slave trade. Thus despite his own record of campaigning against the slave trade and the excesses in India at a time when it was deeply unfashionable, the House of Commons will be listing his portraits and statue as having a ‘connection.’ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/08/24/anti-slavery-mp-edmund-burke-put-transatlantic-slave-trade-register/
The Conservative Party Leadership Contest trundles on. It looks like Truss has just about trussed up Sunak. Hard to pretend to be a man of the people when you are married to one of the wealthiest people on the planet. This cartoon of Maybe lose the cushion says it all: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/morten-morland-times-cartoon-august-25-2022-pdmdxst5r
However in an effort to save his campaign, Sunak has come out and said that he was silence about the lockdowns and the affects he worried about. Certain people like Johnson’s former advisor Dominic Cummings who had to go to Barnard Castle for an eye test and Lee Cain who enjoyed a party called Sunak’s word rubbish and wrong. Recollections differ. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/08/25/rishi-sunak-accused-spouting-dangerous-rubbish-criticism-no/
The Queen’s health continues to be fragile (she is in her 90s) and there are plans afoot to have the ‘kissing hands’ ceremony take place at Balmoral, rather than at Buck House where it is traditionally held. The Queen is currently on her 10 week stay at Balmoral. The Queen, however, will be the one to decide where this ceremony happens. https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/queen-may-appoint-new-prime-minister-at-balmoral-over-health-fears-ngmgkdz0s
Labour continues to be missing action, despite the massive strike action looming, even criminal defence barristers are going to be manning the picket lines in the coming weeks.
Rather allowing good produce to go waste, the discount grocery store announced that it would be selling stunted produce in its shops and called on other supermarkets to do the same. Oftentimes supermarkets have certain size requirements for fruit and veg. To cope with the cost of living crisis, more and more British consumers are turning to the German discounting giants of Lidl and Aldi. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/08/25/supermarket-sell-stunted-fruit-vegetables-avoid-waste-drought/
In Coercive Progressivism (love this term from Caitlin Flanagan!) overreach, an employee of the Gilded Balloon theatre decided to confront and verbally abuse theatre goers because he judged them to be gender critical feminists based on their appearance and that they were attending a comic performance about vaginas. The employee has now been moved to a different theatre where presumably he will not be confronted with middle-aged women enjoying themselves. https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/edinburgh-fringe-audience-harassed-by-venue-employee-in-trans-row-90jk2tjpc
The literary spat of the summer involving the chairperson of the Society of Authors and a growing variety of authors continues. Author and creative writing professor Philip Hensher took umbrage on Monday to being told to ‘play nicely.’ Philip Pullman made several appearance on various twitter feeds, explaining he wasn’t sacked but quit in disgust. Kate Clanchy whose troubles on twitter caused Pullman to resign revealed that on the evening before the Society of Authors issued its ‘play nicely’, the chairperson was busy calling her the polystyrene packing of publishing. One suspects there will be more in the Weekend papers as the chairperson appears determined to keep on tweeting. This substack spills more of the behind scene letters and complaints which author after author sent in and the stock dismissive responses they had in turn. Many considered they were alone in their concerns rather than being united in their disgust at the handling of the situation. https://loobylou.substack.com/p/we-need-real-substantive-change-in?r=1ovpwt&s=w&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
Off to see if there are any more lights etc which can be turned off in the house, counting the number of quilts, blankets, wool hats etc which will be employed in the coming months and eyeing up the beeswax which needs to be made into candles.
About all this… I feel like saying “they’re dead people, they don’t care what you think about them. Isn’t there something more productive you could be doing in the world than raking the past for sinners? Like knitting blankets, hats etc. for people; discovering new energy sources and so on?
I’m living the American dream. I’m the first person in my family to get a college degree, one I got after dropping out of high school due to serious lack of adult supervision. I’m nearly done with my masters degree. I’m happily married. We bought a home this year, with the co-signing but not financial help of my in-laws, because, how else are two teachers able to enter this market? I’m gainfully—no, joyfully employed. I’m a woman with all the rights and freedoms I could’ve ever dreamed. I’m reading this from the comfort of our leather L shaped couch surrounded by my dogs with a warm cup of coffee. This is it.
Same! My brother, sister and I- all first generation in our family with college degrees. My parents were both from broken homes and married as teenagers. They started working on their own education when I was in high school. All five of us cobbled together what we needed through grants, loans, scholarships, and WORK! Lots of work. We worked summers, weekends, evenings, Christmas break, spring break. My parents kept their full time “day jobs” and fit in classes where they could. We all chose colleges we could afford and degrees that were practical and employable. None of us finished with large debts and we were all able to get them paid off.
Love that. It’s amazing to me that my most “progressive” friends never had to work through college (took me 7 years with a full time job) and their parents covered the cost entirely. It’s almost as if…not earning things makes you skeptical of your own achievements and the context they occur in
I should add that I don’t think my story is unique. There must be a million different versions of this same story. I’m aware of many of them among my own friends.
Shout out to America. As a legal immigrant who had my oath ceremony just yesterday (8/25) to become a naturalized US citizen (it was wonderful by the way) I have to say the American Dream will only die if Americans kill it.
A little background. I was born in Ireland, raised in England (both Socialist countries underpinned by capitalism or they’d never function), and I’ve travelled extensively in Europe. Because of work I’ve lived in Germany, the Caucasus, Baku, Azerbaijan (brutally oppressed by Communism until 1992, citizens still horribly treated as their government is still largely corrupt) and then lived 10 years in the Middle East under one of the most oppressive regimes in the world.
So for me as an immigrant now able to call myself a US citizen, I’d say to all naturally born Americans, thank your lucky stars you were born where you were born. By a mere accident of birth you have, if you recognize it, an amazing advantage over any one else born outside the US. Don’t let anyone tell you otherwise.
Remember, only Americans have the ability to kill their American Dream. Don’t do it.
I always look forward to TGIF, and this week was a delight! Excellent choice for filling in for Nellie (to whom I send best wishes). As a physician who financed my own education, I HAD to pay my loans or my medical license would be revoked. Having fulfilled my contract with my lenders, I dislike the idea of my tax dollars being used to pay the debts of wealthy collegians who can afford to pay their own way. I fully support loans and grants for students who qualify financially (which I did, for a $2,000/year Pell grant, as I was working for 2 years between college and medical school making a big $13,000/year). People making 6 figures? Not so much. I also felt the pain of tuition hikes, as my first year of med school, 1990-1, cost $7,500. My final year, 1993-4, cost $12,500. My rent only went up 3% per year, but tuition nearly doubled. Who is doing this math?
Love it. Reminds me of the joke about the 1st grade classroom when the teacher has read the Three Pigs story. She asks the kids what they thought about the story, what someone would say if they were somehow inside it. Little Johnny—it’s always little Johnny, isn’t it?—says “Holy shit! A talking pig!”
Not much else goes on in the class for about an hour.
Aug 26, 2022Liked by Nick Gillespie, Nellie Bowles
“We should neither be slutty nor prudish, but empowered and intentional.” Thank you for sharing this piece. I read it and subscribed. She was telling my story. It feels good to know I’m not alone.
If the student loan vote purchasing scam actually happens, it will set a new precedent in election politics that will be the beginning of our country's death spiral. There is simply no justification for paying $10K to, as the left loves to castigate, privileged citizens, that want to breach their contract with the US to repay their debt.
The only way this becomes fair is for every tax payor to receive a check for $10K that didn't have student loans to forgive. I only type that so as to show how ludicrous the concept is. We've entered into a time where the left is dismantling the fabric of bipartisan governance. They are using impeachment as a political tool, raiding former President's homes, attempting to stack the SCOTUS, changing election laws on the fly, introducing systemic racism into our education and federal bureaucracy, and weaponizing our federal agencies to destroy citizens that disagree with the status quo.
Common Sense, and Substack, and some other rogue podcasts, are our only hopes to fight back, as conventional media are actively helping to destroy our country through their blind advocacy of the progressive movement.
Exactly!
I believe Substack may be the Underground Railroad of our times. Perhaps we will reclaim our freedom through the courage of a few good men & women.
As for your suggestion of $10,000 for each of us .... emphatically, no! Don't be a piker. A million in cash, an electric car in the driveway, &, of course, a chicken in the pot is what we deserve.
Good job Nick Gillespie. Well done.
I hope you know that I wasn't promoting a $10K check for everyone, only stating the ludicrous nature of Biden's demented policy.
Oh yes, your meaning was perfectly clear, as, I hope, was mine.
Yes, the democrats have put Saul Alinsky’s tactics on steroids. Any means to the end. It’s obvious when looking at the events over the past 4 years. Expect more leading up to the November election.
This is basically Obama's third term. All the old Chicago politics 'any means to an end' scorched earth tactics. All the old players, from BHO, Michelle, Susan Rice, Samantha Powers, Valerie Jarrett, et al are behind the scenes promoting policies that they failed to enact during his term. The resurrection of the Iran negotiations are proof.
Yes, JCPOA makes me sick.
It’s making a lot of people sick especially the Israelis
Yes, I’ve followed this issue very closely and know how much consternation this causes inside of Israel. That’s why Obama and Biden’s position on JCPOA is so puzzling. It is very frustrating to me that Jewish American democrats have not abandoned their party over this issue. Makes no sense.
It makes no sense Brian. However, what’s not puzzling to me is the position those two presidents have taken on the JCPOA, Biden just a puppet for Obama and both don’t care about Israel. So maybe after Biden goes back to the deal and gives Iran the billions of $$$ they are bitching about and there is an escalation in hostilities for Israel and ultimately for America then the American Jews will finally realize what their Democratic Party has become and finally make a break from them, I’m not holding my breath!
Why stop at student loans? Let's forgive home loans, car loans, gambling addicts' dept. Hell, let's abolish all loans. Where does it end? If you watched the loan debate on IQ2US, you saw that it immediately degenerated into a racial problem. Why is everything and I mean everything on the left racial?
All it tells me is that the left panders to race. They can't debate you on the issues so they immediately scream RACE! The definition of a racist is anyone who wins and argument with a leftist.
On a side note, the author says he doesn't believe in God but he still uses TGIF. Here are two alternatives:
POETS - Piss on everything tomorrow's Saturday.
or
SHIT - Sure happy it's Thursday.
Have a great weekend all.
As an aside on the racial issue and debt, the black students in my state university system medical school received full tuition grants regardless of financial status. I was fine with the girl who grew up in a poor neighborhood across the street from the methadone clinic, but when the girl with 2 physician parents got a free ride, and her parents used the money they had saved for tuition to buy her a brand new 1990 Mitsubishi 3000, I really didn't think it was fair. But what do I know...
I graduated from college back when dinosaurs roamed the campus and the cost of college was affordable for my below medium income.parents. I worked as a waitress during the school year - worked during the summers and lived in dorm room whose main luxury was a closet big enough for my sparse collegiate wardrobe.
Nowadays from what I read, students leave their parents ' home for the college experience where they live in luxury with climbing walls, olympic size swimming pools, apartment size dormitory rooms, etc. Someone has to pay for all of this and I expect it is added to everyone's tuitiion and room and board >
I was a single parent and the only way my kids could attend college was to live at home, go to a local community college for their first two years before transferring to the state university for the last two years working as they went. They are both happily employed in decent jobs without student loan debt.
When I went school there were only a few dinosaurs left. My entrance exam was they put a mirror under my nose and if I fogged it, I was in.
They tuition for the whole year was under $1000.00 and that was tuition room and board. My dorm room was unairconditioned. I would buy used books for each course. Some cost as little as 2 dollars. Now books for basic courses can cost over 100 dollars.
College now is a racket.
I tell kids to go to a community college and live at home. Nobody cares where you spent your first two years. It is the last two that count.
be. a plumber. make a ton of cash. be a welder. ditto.. heck. collect garbage. do something that no one else want to do.. make a ton of money. go to night school. study whatever interests you. live a productive life
You know everything what really made me mad at your post was the folks allowed it to happen.
Didn’t t know you had such a great sense of humor Lonesome🤣🤣🤣
I am a laugh a minute. So far you are the only one to recognize my God given talent. Thank you.
It’s a pleasure. I think the problem is post Covid most people lost their sense of humor!
Covid has changed our culture.
I am loving you guys and your replies. I friggen love TGIF and Nick here did not disappoint
You've heard from the left over the years that college should be free. This is the first step in going down that road.
Seriously, it starts with this $10K forgiveness. Biden's got two more years, so what's to keep him from bowing to the left again, and wiping out more/all of the remainder.
How do you possibly maintain an underwriting policy after that? How do you charge any student to attend, when the better option is to apply for a loan knowing that it's likely going to be forgiven?
At that point, we've just federalized colleges.
This is either the most ignorant and ill thought out decision made by a President in our nation's history, or the most evil tactic to take over control of our country by the left that's ever been attempted.
I mean, keep in mind this is a bluff. Pelosi has admitted that the President can't unilaterally forgive student loans.
The idea here is that it's a carrot to dangle in front of midterm voters "show up and vote Democrat or else those mean Republicans will take the House and kibosh your loan forgiveness".
It's blatantly illegal, so what will happen is the courts will stop it, Democrats will blame Republican judges for ruining all the fun and turn this into an actual issue, Bob's your uncle.
The courts will stop it but not until after the election. So the proposal will have served its purpose, which is to buy votes.
Every single time, we assume that they couldn’t possibly mean what they say. They will not really do what they propose- it’s all a bluff.
And then, they actually did mean the ridiculous things they say, and they actually do the outrageous things they propose. They get away with it while we are all reassuring ourselves that it’s only a bluff.
But again, Pelosi already said the quiet part out loud - "only Congress has the authority".
It's a bluff in the sense that Biden already knows Congress and/or the courts will crumple up his Executive Order and throw it in the trash.
I would actually support totally forgiving all debt if the federal government would remove itself from the student loan program.
I have yet to read column from anyone on the right or left who's considering this a bluff.
I can only hope that it's a bluff.
Yeah well media is broken that way.
left-wing media don't want to say it's a bluff, because that would defeat the purpose of said bluff.
And right-wing media can stoke more outrage by taking it at face value than by admitting it's a bluff.
So nobody has any incentive to say it's a bluff, even though that's what it is.
This fits in with “any means to an end.”
With the tactics the democrats have pulled over the past four years, sure - this fits in with that activity.
I don't know how many people are going to believe it, thought... as we say in the aerospace industry, nothing's real until it comes with a check attached. And there's no way they can get the checks out before the election.
in real estate. it is "never spend the money until you see the taillights leave the escrow company"
Jon, ignorance may be on your part!
How taxpayers benefit when students attain higher levels of education
1. More highly educated people contribute more in taxes.
2. Those with more education or less from social support programs.
3. More highly educated people are less likely to incur incarceration cost
Rising student levels of education used net benefit to the public budget.
Are you really trying to sell the idea that taxpayers (like plumbers , truck drivers, and waitresses) benefit from the higher levels of education attained by students who major in things like gender studies? And then find that their higher level of education only gets them a job as a barista? So the taxpayers should show proper gratitude and pay for the attainment of this great education?
Please don’t bother with the factoid links- they convince no one.
The people you are talking about already have their education so all the things you talk about are going to happen. Now that they have their education it is time to be responsible and pay back their loans. they took out these loans with their eyes open. They knew the consequences of taking out a loan. Now it is time to act like an adult and pay it back.
Why should I as a taxpayer have to pay back the loans of a bunch of irresponsible leaches?
Then go about it the right way, through Congress. If it is as society-improving and noble as you say, it should be a popular issue and no problem to pass - especially with a D majority in the Senate.
Jen, you say: “…it should be a popular issue and no problem to pass….” But here’s the reality: https://youtu.be/5tu32CCA_Ig.
So you’re saying the reality is so bad that a president can only solve problems by breaking the law?
Then why go after Trump about illegal behavior, if it’s necessary?
So many assumptions, with so little rationality!
It’s being done on purpose.
With the intent to achieve the end you speak of.
The policy is as gross as draining the strategic oil reserve in the run up to the election.
Biden & Co are desperate at this point - they need to buy the vote....and arrest Trump to get him out of the way...feels like 'FASCISM' to me...
Right, the Right will just answer with their own bonanza giveaway.
I borrowed $8000 through 1994 and by 2014, after literally twenty years of paying $250 per month, still owed ***$12,000.*** This was before the predatory lending habits of colleges really set in. My husband and I were glad to refinance our home in 2020 to take care of this debt (and others) - that part of our refinance is already paid off, and we didn't have to try very hard.
So I'm super sympathetic to people getting absolutely abused by college loans, but I think the answer is - just cancel it. No repayment, just sorry, guys - we're cancelling all the interest over 3% on student debt, retroactively and permanently. Tell all the colleges with huge endowments they have to pay it. Stop the problem as well as offering a solution. This is a bad solution but better than what Biden just gave us.
On this issue, I'm a bad Libertarian.
I kind of get that. A lot of students were sold down the river, with promises of "get a degree, any degree, and you'll pull down a six-figure job at graduation." I just don't appreciate when I point out that I paid off my student loan, and I also worked to get through school, and the Millennial response is "sucks to be you".
This could easily become the norm because it is so much easier than dealing with the hard problem of fixing our universities.
Regular debt jubilees.
Nothing wrong with the universities according to the left...they're doing exactly as purposed. And debt "forgiveness" (i.e.; transfer) is the perfect way to energize and embolden them even more. They can now say: "Look! We got our enemies to actually PAY for everything we're doing!!! More please!"
I agree.
John hit it on the head. I understand the problem it's trying to solve, but this "student loan forgiveness" plan just feels a little banana-republic-ish. In Latin America the politicians don't even bother trying to hide that they're buying votes; this feels the same.
Excellent comments.
Jon, you say: “If the student loan vote purchasing scam actually happens, it will set a new precedent in election politics that will be the beginning of our country’s death spiral.” the definition of a scam is: to deceive and defraud: (to deprive of something by deception) there is no deceiving or deception here, it’s in front of God and everybody.
Nearly 90% of those receiving relief earn less than $75,000 a year. Democrats are helping out the average worker, not the rich. What really upset you is there might be a bunch of folks who vote for a Democrat because a politician actually helps them!
That is so far off it blows my mind.
My daughter, who is in her 2nd yr of law school and who just got a job offer at the equivalent of $140k just got 2/3 of all her student debt wiped out.
How you ask?
Well, she worked all the way through college and still managed to graduate in 3 yrs, Phi Bets Kappa, with a degree in neuroscience and a minor in economics from Virginia Tech. Got some small scholarships but mostly she paid for it herself. Then she earned a full ride to law school.
Her entire debt after 2 yrs of law school, because she has worked and saved was only $16k. Biden just wiped out $10k because she is still a student and has not yet started her career. That $140k will start next year.
SO....she will walk out of law school making $140k with only about $10k in debt for her entire education. She can pay that off in 6 months.
And precisely WHY should we have to ask taxpayers to cover the stupid decisions of others?
If you went to college and got a degree in literature or XXX Studies, and then realized that the only jobs you were gonna get were in academia but for that you need a doctorate, and then blow $100k in loans to get a job paying $50K as an adjunct, that is YOUR stupid fault.
If you went to college for a degree in social work and spent $80 grand to do it without considering that the best you could hope to earn when you graduate is $40k, then you are a MORON.
SO yeah, I got an issue with covering people who make stupid decisions. I have an issue with throwing people money, even my daughter, who just got lucky and who are heading to be in the top 10% of earners in their early 20's. I got an issue with people who are unwilling to do what my daughter did, work through school, during school, full time on breaks, never went on trips or Spring Break, skipped to social scene at college,but busted her ass and started saving for college with summer jobs as a 15 yr old.
I got an issue with people who borrow stupid amounts of money on a hope when I had to enlist to qualify as independent for financial aid and serve 4 yrs to earn the GI Bill. I got an issue with people who do that and go to the school they dream of and not the one they can afford, the way I did. I could have gone to BC or Northeastern, Amherst, but I chose a small state college because it was affordable. I worked almost full time while carrying a full load. Sure, it took me 5 yrs instead of 4, but I graduated with $2,500 in debt and walked into a job paying $33k a year. That was 1994.
I got an issue with people who are too IGNORANT to realize that college is a business decision. Where you go, when you go, how you go is all about ONE thing, getting out with a useful education and the piece of paper to prove it, with the absolute minimal amount of cost and as close to no debt as you can pull off. People who borrow a ton of money on degrees with no immediate return and who go for the college experience, get what their stupidity deserves.
All great points. It seems to me that the people who complain the most about student debt are the ones whose choices resulted in debt they couldn’t afford to pay back. I think it’s difficult for most people to admit they may have made some poor choices and that they may have to live with the consequences. Guess what? Sometimes life isn’t fair and nothing is owed to anyone, ever. You work your ass off and sometimes shitty things still happen. That sucks.
we don’t change everything to help people that made bad decisions or had no foresight. We could change the way people can borrow. Maybe make it different process to begin with idk. But yes, everyone that signs up for those loans is responsible to pay them back and if you’re not bright enough to really examine what goes into the process in the present as well as the future, well you sort of get what comes to you. It’s not our burden to bare imo.
While getting my hair cut yesterday, my Polish immigrant stylist was updating me on her kids. Her 18 yo son just entered an electrician apprenticeship program because she can't afford to help pay for his college and does not want him to be saddled with so much debt. Her older daughter completed law school and she helped as much as she could. So now, with this absurd wealth transfer, the 18 yo will be paying for help the older sister/lawyer pay off some of her debt! I suggested her son should negotiate with his sister to provide free legal services in exchange.
To be fair, I blame a lot of people beyond just these borrowers, who, in large part, were just teens when they started borrowing.
1. I blame parents who do not take the time to teach their kids to look at college as a business investment but instead tell them to get into the best school they can and figure out how to pay for it. I blame parents who do not take the time to teach their kids financial literacy, to help them understand the long term financial consequences of their choices in school, how they pay for it, and what that looks like AFTER graduation. I blame them for telling these kids that they can be anything they want without consideration of what that means in terms of life style after school.
2. I blame HS teachers and guidance counselors for insisting to every single kid that they MUST attend college and they MUST do it right away after graduation. There are a lot of good choices in trades and other careers that either do not require a degree or if the career might require one it is not necessary to have it completed until your either ready to move into some form of management or to start your own business. You can go make a pretty penny as an airline mechanic, take management courses at night over a number of years at a community college, then move up into management if that is what you want. There are LOADS of jobs in IT where all you have to do is take a couple of training courses, get a couple of certifications, and walk into a job paying $70k. Toss in some classes at night, and you can move up nicely and be making 6 figures in 5 or 6 yrs.
3. I blame the universities who pitch their services with slick advertising to HS juniors. They sell the "experience" of going to their school. Anyone who has actually attended college knows that after the first semester anyone with any sense is just working to get that paper and get out. The "college experience" is not real for most people after that and it is a very very expensive luxury.
I blame all of the above for not teaching kids that when they look at a college or a major the first thing they need to ask themselves is "What kind of job is this going to lead to?" followed immediately by "What is the market for those jobs and how much do they pay to start?".
We have GOT to STOP selling kids on college as the golden ticket or an absolute necessity. We have GOT to STOP telling them they should follow their dreams and embrace the college experience. NO....NO...NO......College is a SERIOUS business decision with a huge price tag and we are lying and manipulating and selling it to 17 yr olds to get them to go without helping them to see the consequences of their choices or really letting them know what all their choices are.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4K8ZKkzNbD0
"If you went to college for a degree in social work and spent $80 grand to do it without considering that the best you could hope to earn when you graduate is $40k, then you are a MORON." As a retired educator, who left college with a $5,000 loan (which was actually very hard to pay off at the great salary of $8900 -- but I did), I had to chuckle when I learned that my nephew's now wife got her elementary education degree at Vanderbilt University. Thing is, her dad is a doctor, so she has no student loans but if her parents hadn't paid for it, she likely wouldn't have a degree from Vanderbilt. Parents are also MORONS for the absurdity of a degree that costs more than the salary from that degree.
Here’s your rant, in ten words: I got mine, your stupid, you can rot in hell!
Oh...your reading comprehension skills are off. Must be a recent grad.
No, what I am saying is that nobody is entitled to go to the college of their dream right out of HS and expect to do nothing but focus on studies and the "college experience".
I am saying that nobody is entitled to go spend stupid money on a worthless degree because it interests them or inspires them unless they are willing to write the check.
College and getting a college degree is a BUSINESS decision, not a personal growth one.
You want to borrow $90k on an engineering degree from MIT? Maybe that is a good business investment.
You want to borrow $90k to get a doctorate in Sociology from Florida State? Maybe not so smart.
College is too expensive and takes too much time to think of it as anything but a business choice.
Maybe you have to enlist to qualify as independent and get the GI Bill as I did.
Maybe you got to work multiple jobs or even a full time job and take 5 yrs to graduate.
Maybe you go get a trade, work full time and string together enough classes at night over a decade to get a degree.
What you ABSOLUTELY DO NOT DO, is go to a school where you are going to have to borrow so much money that you are going to be destitute for a decade.
You absolutely do NOT pick a degree that leads to jobs with very narrow career options and those career options are all low paying.
You pick the school you can most easily afford, you work as much as you can to pay as you go, you scrap for every scholarship you can, you do not party, you do not take trips, you work and you study and pick a degree that will give you a track toward a higher paying career.
College is an investment. Nothing more. You want to maximize your return.
Anyone who believes otherwise is a fool.
Yeah, bravo. Lol at "Oh...your reading comprehension skills are off. Must be a recent grad."
Bravo Lemon, great post!
Excellent post where to from here though?
Elect Republicans.
Across the board let’s start in November!
"dog whistle" = uncomfortable truth
"micro aggressions" = uncomfortable truth that hurts my feelings
"cultural appropriation' = I'm sorry, that concept is too stupid to even make fun of.
cultural appropriation = sharing is not caring
Haha, I know right? ‘Cultural appropriation’ is actually cultural appreciation
As Glenn Reynolds likes to say, if you can hear the dog whistle, you must be the dog.
The American Dream...is largely gone. Those with the energy and determination to really hustle can sometimes still find it. But many of the paths to securing a middle-class life that were still being sold to my generation (Gen-X), ended up being dead ends in the wilderness. In many cases, the paths had been shut down because of the way the Boomers abused them.
Nor does it help that inflation (particularly real estate inflation) has made it more and more difficult for young people to find housing they can afford. My husband and I managed to avoid this largely by moving where the real estate was affordable. But that is becoming less and less of an option.
But the central premise of the American Dream--the part where our founding principals are the key to being free to seek the life we want for ourselves--has been destroyed by the Left's utter denigration of America. They hate our history. They hate our Constitution. They hate the Western values that allowed us to become a bastion of freedom. When America is a place that can only be hated, what room is there for an American Dream?
The American Dream persists in the immigrants who come to this country.
I have reconsidered my view on immigration. I want more Legal Immigration because we can “rob” bad countries of their intellectual capital, and because Americans aren’t having 2.1 babies per family. These legal immigrants become net contributors to America practically immediately. But I still oppose the flood of illegals over the border that burden our communities and serve the cartels, bringing drugs and crime.
Well said. As a legal immigrant who had my oath ceremony just yesterday to become a naturalized US citizen I couldn’t agree more with you. Those of us who have lived in other countries, including reasonably wealthy western nations, know how great this country is if you are willing to apply yourself. Unfortunately many of those lucky enough to be born here, fail to recognize their great fortune.
Congratulations! And welcome, new citizen!
Congratulations! Glad you are here!
Well done!
JAE that's great!
Great to have you! Godspeed.
Congratulations! My brother's partner was naturalized 7 years ago. Another American doctor...lucky us! And I know you'll be a great American too!
Thank you, I truly appreciate your faith in me. But I especially appreciate you imagining I’ll be a “great” American. Those are big shoes to fill. I assure you I’ve tried over 33 years of living in this wonderful country, and even though I’ve had to leave it many times for work commitments, to impart to others how very fortunate we are to Iive here. Some refuse to see it. Usually they are those who were born here. What they don’t see is, you never fully appreciate freedom until you lose it.
So true. My daughter who is a civil engineering major was in Guatemala last week with Engineers Without Borders. They were building a water distribution center to bring clean water up to the mountainous area where the people are living and currently have no access to clean water. She's 21 and her comment on returning was, "I needed this more than they needed me."
One of the probing questions their faculty advisor asked (which occurred each evening) was "if five fingers on one hand could each produce a liquid what would those five liquids be." All of the student volunteers said water, of course, but when the local builder who worked with the group took his turn, he said "hot water".
We take SO much for granted. We are so 1st world that we have time to think about flipping pronouns while other struggle to get clean or hot water!
You will be a great American!
Thank you for that, and thank you to your wonderful daughter for her willingness to help, she gives us all hope. You clearly raised her well.
One thing I’ve always told people on my journey when they have tried to denigrate America and only focus on its faults; Yes, it’s true it has faults, but it’s the spirit of America that everyone clamors for. Some say they hate America, and yet they want to be just like it!
We know this from people beating down the door to come here. Not too many other countries (who? 🤷♀️) where that happens. Not even Australia where they’ve reverted to paying people and their passage to immigrate.
Now, can that change, when as you say pronouns are the main focus, no. People will still want to come here. But not for the right reasons I fear.
Congratulations!
Congratulations!
We need a pause. We need everyone in America to learn the language, the history, and the culture. We need old timers and new comers to love and revere our country and it’s principles.
Agreed. If you want to leave your country of origin and emigrate anywhere, why drag with you the things that made you leave?
Who is going to teach them that, college professors?
The woke locals hate the language, the history, and the culture, so it's not like immigrants are any worse than your run of the mill progressive.
Those who teach citizenship prep classes are usually patriotic Americans, not Woke people. Unless they have invaded that area as well.
Yes the distinction between "legal" and "illegal" is essential in the immigration debate. We need immigrants, but we cannot exist as a nation if we don't have controlled, limited immigration.
What I can never understand is those who say they care for illegal immigrants trying to make a better life for themselves and their families, yet they refuse to see the egregious abuse heaped on these poor souls by coyotes among others when coming here illegally. Why can they not see their “caring” is doing nothing but fueling this evil and filling the pockets of the swines doing the abuse. I can only conclude it’s cognitive dissonance on the part of these people, and they are almost entirely left wing and Democrats.
It has been the habit of Democrats for a long time to talk and talk and talk about compassion, but to institute policies that, while seemingly "kind" on the surface, actually lead to horrible outcomes.
YES! I'll take lots of skilled, legal immigrants. I might suggest a special Visa program for high-tech Taiwanese workers. What better way to build a semiconductor industry than to poach existing talent? And there's probably a lot of that talent that would love to escape the hot breath of the neighboring totalitarian gorilla. That's just an idea and in the end, I don't care where they come from as long as they're ready to embrace Western culture.
But I'm tired of being told I'm racist for not wanting poor, central Americans with no skills to wade across the Rio Grande and be welcomed with open arms by our elites who want cheap gardeners, roofers, and nannies, to the detriment of the most vulnerable of our fellow citizens who must compete for those very jobs.
You have a great idea there about the Taiwanese, Sir Brian. Probably too smart for anyone in gov to think of it.
I agree. Almost every legal immigrant I encounter is more American at heart than most post-Gen-X Americans. I would like to see a program where countries who send immigrants here would have to accept a certain number of America-haters who want nothing more than to leave in exchange. So many of the America-haters have discovered that other countries have much higher immigration standards than America does, and will not take them.
Whoa, great post.
If I may, I'd like to push back against the generic 'Boomers' reference when addressing the abuse claim. Democrats, during the Boomer years, controlled the House for 40 years, and passed countless bills, against Republican wishes, that led to where we are today. The history of Democrats using federal dollars to buy votes goes way back, and is on display, in a shameless and unprecedented way, with the loan forgiveness scam.
So, it wasn't a 'Boomer' issue, imho, it was a 'New Deal' issue that spun out of control.
I'm a Boomer. I think we inherited the greatest nation in human history from our parents, "The Greatest Generation." We passed on to the next generation a smoking ruin.
The mistake we made in the late 50s, 60s and 70s was thinking that the prosperity we were enjoying by being the only nation who's manufacturing infrastructure was not damaged after WWII, was going to last, even after the rest of the world rebuilt. We started writing checks (mostly on endowments) that we would ultimately not be able to cash.
As the old saying goes, rough times make strong men, strong men make good times, good times make weak men, weak men make rough times.
I, a 69-year-old Boomer, am always telling my 26-year-old daughter: “Sorry, sweetheart, but you’ve really been screwed by my generation and all because we could never say “no.”
I'm 62 and my kids are 21, 20. I say no plenty! I think it's the Gen Z parents who have a hard time saying no.
Good point.
I'm not talking about problems caused by Boomers in government; this happened well before then. I'm talking about the behavior of Boomers in their youth that caused older generations to stop giving young people a hand up. No one trusted young people anymore, thanks to the Boomers. A great many policies changed as a result of Boomer behavior.
Celia, I’m a Boomer (later phase, not old enough for Woodstock) who thinks that most of the ideas from my youth were a bunch of BS. As I’ve grown older I do wonder - where the hell were the adults back then?
The university presidents were kissing the asses of the students who demanded that students should make all the rules.
Look at pictures of political leaders from the 70’s. They grew their hair a little longer and tried to be cool, to court the youth vote. Ted Kennedy and Gary Hart come to mind, but they all did it to some extent.
Media and advertisers fell all over themselves catering to the crazy ideas of the young. Very few stood up to it in any way- the adults were trying to be just as cool as the kids. That only made the kids disrespect them more.
The last vestiges of the generation of adults that tried so hard to make the kids like them? They are the octogenarians like Biden and Pelosi that run things now. Finally they are as cool as the kids.
You've got the right of it, Heyjude.
Where were the adults? They were overwhelmed by teenagers. Until the Boomers, there was no such thing. Vogue figured out that teens had money. Commerce found it was money they could easily get by pandering to the youth movement.
Sex, drugs, and rock 'n roll followed. I don't think the adults had muchuva chance against the onslaught. I dunno, but imagine they were somewhat shell-shocked by the Depression and WWII, and just couldn't fathom their kids activities.
It was a trying time, and I'm sure many parents were overwhelmed. But what really strikes me now, looking back on it all, is how many 40ish adults tried so hard to dress and act like 20 year olds. Nothing more pathetic than adults who try to be just like the cool kids, and many did just that. Boomers didn't originate refusing to grow up - it was the generation before us.
Edit: Maybe I'm just mad that they foisted "adult contemporary" music on us. They were 100% responsible for Air Supply 😕
Democrats didn't strangle housing construction to drive up the price of existing homes (so now houses that boomers bought 40 years ago for $50k are now worth $800k).
As a legal immigrant for years and now a naturalized US citizen as of yesterday, I say to you do what Americans have always done. Fight back. Not physically, but ideologically. If you aren’t already doing so, talk about how much you love America, its history (recognizing its warts of course), its western values, the constitution, and tout the American Dream as a reality. The Dream will only die if Americans themselves kill it. Don’t let that happen is my suggestion to you as a newly formed US citizen. Defeat the hate with love. Please.
And this post is a perfect example of why we need people to immigrate here. We grow complacent and forget what is great about our home.
Hear hear! Congratulations on your citizenship, so happy to have you 💕
Well said, I agree.
I am an immigrant too. I have been a citizen now for have of my life. Until very recently I was convinced that the American Dream is alive.
It is alive. Only way to kill it is to give up on it. Hold the line and stand your ground. The determination that got you to the US will carry you through. Believe in yourself and America and we’ll all be better off for it.
I suppose the American Dream is streets paved with gold. I'd settle just to have my street paved.
Well, I’d say its less about gold (immigrants generally aren’t looking for an easy life) and more about being able to have a go at starting something new. Entrepreneurial ideas and innovation have oozed out of America in abundance for decades, and the world has benefited. In Europe we have an attitude when something’s broken or needs improving you’ll hear, “The government should get on that”. In America if something’s broken or needs fixing, you’ll more likely hear, “How can we do that”. If you lose that attitude, then what? So good luck getting your road paved. Begin now perhaps, with a new attitude.
No, not at all. For me it was always about freedom to be myself and to live my life the way I want and not how my socialist government planned it. It took me long and hard years to get out. Thank G-d I was young and happy to start my life from scratch, from the very bottom. Ours is a rich country, so with success comes a level of comfort in life, no doubt, but it was never about “streets paved with gold”, and I know many who feel the same. This is a perilous time for the western culture. And yea, many roads need to be paved and bridges repaired. We got distracted by culture wars!
I feel the same way, TxFrog! The streets in our little town get worse and worse, while the wealthy idiots who run the show spend money on their own pet projects.
🤣
🤣🤣
Curious, what paths have boomers shut down ?
I agree with you on the left. Their hate is infecting our society and is very dangerous.
Saving up to buy a house. That worked when houses cost $40,000, but not when they cost $1.2 million.
Our 1st house in WA state was $42,500, new construction, in 1977. We bought it with a VA loan. My dad saw it for sale a few years ago and checked the price - $399,000
The behavior of Boomers resulted in older generations having less trust and respect for young people. Policies got changed due to Boomers.
For example, It was much harder to find a job in 1985 than back in 1965. Instead of talking to the boss about a job, soulless job applications handled by HR became the norm.
Thanks to the feminist Boomers seeking Yuppie careers, housewives and stay-at-home-moms--the favored norm in the 60s--were looked down on as worthless in the 80s and 90s.
Pretty much everything that we Gen-Xers sought to do, we found that Boomers had already been there and wrecked.
👍👍
Celia, the American dream for 90% of people, is rarely attainable, but for the 10% who run The Present Day capitalistic system, the American dream is doing just fine!
ZERO room left to dream😢😢
Colleges are a racket and they are a racket backstopped and fed by the federal government.
Tuition today is INSANE and it can only BE insane for two reasons, demand and lots of funding. If fewer kids wanted to go to college and even fewer had the money to pay for it, tuitions would not be where they are.
1. Employers have made a college degree a necessity for even the most basic entry level position.
2. We have told kids that the ONLY path to success is through going right to college.
3. Societally, we have created a social structure where those with college degrees (the more expensive the better) are considered to sit higher on the social pecking order.
4. We have made funding this so so much easier with federally backed loans.
In short, we created astronomical DEMAND for a college degree while pumping huge amounts of secured money at colleges.
And, what are we getting for this? Academia is a mess. Most professors are chasing tenure and doing what it requires to get it. Generally, that does not mean TEACHING, it means publishing and attending conferences. TAs and Adjuncts teach, when they teach. So nobody is really providing the education we are supposedly paying for.
Worse, when they ARE teaching, they too often engage in pedagogy, concerned more with passing on the social mores of a very left wing academic culture than assuring kids learn their subjects and develop skills.
Throw in the fact that because colleges are a racket, out to make money for the administrators and tenured professors etc, they see students as customers and keeping the customer happy and willing to pay is the number one priority. SO, schools cater to the whims of 17 yr olds and lower standards.
Our higher education system is an abomination.
Agree! And here’s another infuriating thing about academics—-they get to have consulting contracts for thousands of dollars a day while also collecting their fat university paychecks. They double dip, everyone knows it, and no one cares. And they can dump their consulting work on their graduate students who get paid nothing for the work. Ask me how I know this….
I did not mention that but I should have. OH....I DO know.
I had a tenured professor at Stanford do some work for a client of mine. He billed them $1,300 an hour for over 3 yrs. Did I mention this was a federal client? His grad students and recently graduated grad students worked for him. He billed the government $350 pr/hr for the recent grads but you know he sure as heck was not paying them that.
Heck, I remember my economics professor in college. He was tenured but was also a practicing attorney locally.
These adjuncts today, they can do alright if they have consulting gigs. The ones that suffer are the fools who teach things like Literature or XXX Studies. Nobody needs them to consult. But if you have something in tech, the sciences, engineering, math, economics etc., you can make a bundle consulting.
I think the XXX Studies profs have got in the game now via DEI/antiracism consulting. Ibram Kendi charges out at $40,000 per hour.
Yet we do need PhDs in American literature such as today’s guest writer/editor, Nick Gillespie, who did a brilliant job distilling the week’s news. He wrote some great memorable lines, such as Biden making everyone forget about inflation.
We do not need the numbers we are producing. Nor do we need to be charging what we do to get a degree with limited career options. PhDs in literature are primarily geared to teach but we have too many of them and when they DO get jobs in academia they end up spending most of their time chasing tenure writing essays and research papers on increasingly inane topics that are designed to appeal to their peers social positions.
What we NEED is more people with solid critical thinking skills, problem solving skills, with good math and communications skills. THATs what we need more of, across the board.
You are so right. The vast majority of college graduates have a degree in business administration. What the h—l is that? They have no clue upon graduation either. Meanwhile, Biden is throwing billions to fund chip manufacturing in the US. Do we have people with expertise? The administration does not care. Throwing money to the wind is what they are good at. It turns out there is only a handful of schools in the US that prepare semiconductor engineers, and we have 10 times less of them than we need because number of people majoring in electric engineering has plummeted in recent years. It is hard! Why bother when a youngster can major in nothing burger of “business administration”.
Employers made a college degree a requisite because the k-12 education system has deteriorated to the point that a high school diploma does not mean a candidate is capable of reading, writing, and doing basic math.
The teachers unions destroyed our k-12 system, and the perceived saint Jimmy Carter sold out to them, creating the education department to pay back their political support.
Anne, thats not why we did it, and I am somebody who hires 40 plus people a year.
We did it to weed out resume's. It used to be that I would get 50-100 resumes for a single position. I do not have the time to weed through that many and neither do my recruiters. The answer to that was to keep jacking up the education requirements to weed out people.
Is there something to what you say? Sure, but hell, even most college grads today are better at social activism than basic algebra and cannot write anything more complex than a tweet. God, the writing skills of your average college grad today are awful. Never mind their reading comprehension, they do not have the attention span for it, they need things spoon fed to them.
This is great. I was going to comment along these lines, but there’s no need. You articulated everything I’ve been thinking and saying for the past decade. I am a product of the times when high schools were actively scrapping vocational programs and the options post-graduation were generally presented as college or failure. The liberal arts university I attended from 2006-2010 was doing their level best to go woke (while pick-pocketing anyone and everyone) even back then. Fortunately I had a lot of well-grounded family, friends, and teachers growing up, so I was at least immune to these efforts. I’m not their target clientele, though.
This is well said, that employers are a large part of the problem. When you need a 4 year degree for anything above "fry cook", do we wonder that the demand for a 4 year degree, any at all, has skyrocketed? Regardless of whether the 4 year degree has any relationship to the job demanding it?
I work in IT. The bulk of technical skills can be self taught via online courses, or even in person boot camps to get the basics. The actual job skills come from on the job experience though. No course is going to teach in-house proprietary systems and business logic and in house processes. That requires on the job learning and training, which corporations must learn that they need to get back in the business of doing. Hiring with the expectations of training and promoting within, with careful strategies of seeding in new talent for new ideas and methodologies along the way.
There's a lot of "professional" jobs that don't require necessarily a 4 year degree - what it has substituted for is a "certification" of achievement that the employer has some basis to believe the applicant has committed to a program of achievement, committment to goals, etc. But these markers can be found in alternatives - certifications, prior job history, skills assessments, etc.
And yet - I don't want to discount the value of a general liberal arts degree in general. Having foundations in a broad based educational background is of course also beneficial - we don't also just want a world run by one tracked savant engineers focused solely on delivering technical efficiencies either. So it should be balanced as to the qualifications at perhaps differening levels of the career. And here's where corporations can also serve - pay for the "well rounded" educations for promising up and comers to fill those higher seats, on the corp's dollars. Corporations have too long demanded a highly educated and highly skilled workforce while externalizing the investments for that on to the public, and then crying for H1B Visas when they can't find their purple unicorns (and are not also getting those purple unicorns via H1B either).
Yes, well said. One of the consequences of this is that there are too many graduates with degrees that do not have value in the marketplace. Classic overproduction. And the schools suffer no economic consequences of this because they are insulated by the government. A total farce.
You forgot the most important point: This "racket" is the engine of left-wing politics.
THAT, more than anything else, is why Biden is shoveling more money at it.
Here's my personal take on the loan forgiveness. As a result of capitalized interest, I owe more on my student loans than our total gross worth. I found out, too late, that the career I so desperately wanted (to be a professor of English) was not open to me because I am not--nor was I willing to pretend to be--a Far Left Wokie.
So, for me, $20,000 in loan forgiveness is meaningless. A mere fraction of what I owe, and will never, ever be able to afford to pay back.
For me, the ability to discharge student loans in bankruptcy--after a certain number of years and a clear inability to pay--is the only solution that would help. And it would help all the others who are drowning in unpayable student loans...*without* giving handouts to people with six-figure incomes.
Oh, the capitalized interest! I wonder if people realize that student loans are pretty much the only debt where they’re allowed to do that. Both a mortgage and a car loan have a simple interest plan only. The student loan industry is really quite a racket. The mob would be so proud!
my student loan has about doubled the amount I originally borrowed. And I've been paying it all along. What a scam. Of course they can do that knowing you can't discharge it. They'll take it from your Social Security if it goes that long!
Yeah, I was quite shocked that they were allowed to do that.
I went to college decades ago, to inexpensive state universities, had part time jobs, and only needed $13k student loan, which I paid off in maybe 4 yrs. I never got, nor needed counseling on the loan because I was in a scientific field and my earning expectations were good. So here are my questions—-how do the universities and lenders rationalize lending students so much money? Do they have any responsibility for what they are doing? Shouldn’t there be some sort of counselor helping students understand the earnings potential of different degrees vs their loan payments? It seems criminal to make it so easy to saddle kids with debts, but it’s also unacceptable to forgive their loans. Landscapers who never went to college but pay taxes are paying off those loans.
It's very close to child abuse. These kids aren't in a position to fully understand the magnitude of the decisions they're making, that only benefit the lending institutions, the colleges and the Democrat party.
Then let’s have an intense social media campaign telling kids these degrees from expensive schools aren’t worth it and their debts will crush them.
We'll have the posts deleted, at best, or banned, at worst.
So true, another item to censure.
I have to disagree.
An 18 year old is old enough to sign up for military service but isn’t old enough to do basic arithmetic?
The problem is that colleges do *nothing* to help students consider whether they will be able to get jobs that will allow them to repay the loan. No questions are asked about your major. No information is given about the prospects of future employment.
And it doesn't matter to the university, because they have the money, and they have ZERO responsibility for what happens to the students in the future. There is no incentive to counsel students.
One has to wonder why they are allowed to vote then?
Colleges take no responsibility. They allow students to believe that OF COURSE they will be able to get a job that will allow them to pay off their loan. In many cases, they know that is unlikely to be true, but that doesn't stop them.
Read Grisham’s book, Rooster Bar.
There’s actually a book about exactly that: John Grisham’s novel, Rooster Bar. It’s pretty good. Sounds like you’d enjoy reading it.
Agree totally. I believe that allowing young people to take on ridiculous amounts of debt, without fully appreciating the risk, and not allowing the debt to be eligible for bankruptcy is criminal. It's evidence of what the real intention of the student loan program is, a troika of Lending institutions. Universities and the federal government to promote an agenda at the cost of the tax payers.
I worked at the Student Accounts department of a well-ranked private university - I can confirm that my department treated these loans like Monopoly money. They were part of the “aid package “ (a laughable term)
It is horrifying that student loans can be for more than books, tuition, and room and board. The equivalency would be a car loan that would cover the cost of the car, insurance, along with a provision for gas and entertainment costs.
Celia, thanks for sharing your experience and for not caving. Your talents are well applied here in the comments. I always look for you.
Brad at Euphoric Recall's provides an excellent analysis of the Biden's loan forgiveness https://euphoricrecall.substack.com/p/my-monthly-rent-identifies-as-student
Oi, that sucks : ( Well I graduated with a BS in IT degree (ultimately from a private for profit - the only one doing online courses at the time when I had a baby and could do course work at night after part time work and baby time), that finished up the degree on top of the two years of credits I accumulated from "regular" community college and state u a few years prior but hadn't completed. And I am, thankfully, in renumerative work from that degree and am nothing more than thankful for where it got me.
But.. man, can I tell you that the private loans I had to take out for the private for profit finisher about doubled in 10 years from what I had originally borrowed. And I am paying them back but had to take periods of deferrment for income reasons, but still. Double what I borrowed? Seems insane.
Agree bankruptcy should be reintroduced to student loans - with the caveat that defaulted loans get pushed back on the school. If they didn't provide a degree that was able to be repay the money they put into their pockets when it was disbursed, they should own some of that. But I also think the interest capitalizing on student loans needs a review as well. Because that's probably a huge component as to why some loans are not repayable. They're doubling, tripling, even when you're making the "minimum" payment and doing your due diligence to repay, but it's set up to take much more than you ever borrowed - and this should not be treated like revolving consumer credit interest charging. There should be a flat interest fee that is calculated against the original principle, and that's it.
I'm finally on a path to full repayment but it does grind my gears that I spent years paying interest when the interest continued to capitalize. Yes I get that's how "interest" works but even my mortgage is fairer than how they charged interest with the student loans. Of course knowing you can't declare bankruptcy, why would they do any different?
Oh, the universities benefit vastly from the system exactly the way it is, so they have no incentive to change anything, and every incentive to raise tuition as often as they can get away with it.
There is something really rotten with loan forgiveness. The left ignores and dismisses this point , but it is unequivocally unfair to people who study real disciplines and get real jobs and pay their loans.
Although I do see a problem with the loan complex. At 18 years old you really don’t understand the economics of the burden. There has to be a better way. Perhaps a simple solution is to require students pursue a real major? Happy for the taxpayers to risk capital on potential engineers, but these liberal studies are terrible in so many ways. Most of these kids just show up at college and “take classes” with no real dedication to an investment in skill development.
The better way is to get the federal government out of the process and let financial institutions and universities accept the risk for the debt. Let the universities decide whether a $100K loan for a 'whatever' studies degree is worth the risk of default.
The college industry needs to be disconnected from our federal government as we've created a progressive indoctrination program that's being subsidized by hundreds of billions of taxpayer dollars. Tuition costs have risen at six times the inflation rate, while the product has become less valuable. That only happens with federal intervention.
The student loan approval process has divorced itself from actual actuarial science and approved loans that aren't based on risk, but according to the benefit of the Universities, or the progressive movement, while putting the taxpayers at risk.
The Journal of Free Black Thought is running an excellent piece on Oregon's teachers union's successful effort to end standardized testing: https://freeblackthought.substack.com/p/for-equity-oregon-ditched-a-standardized
A professor of philosophy laid out his strategy for addressing the student loan debacle in the comments - Look for Jim - https://freeblackthought.substack.com/p/for-equity-oregon-ditched-a-standardized/comments"
Thanks for the link. Good comments. Any party not wholly owned by the professional-managerial class could implement his idea of putting schools on the hook for graduates whose degrees aren't worth anything economically. Right now, only 1 party appears even close to "not owned by the PMC", but you never know.
I agree, the system we have now is flooding the market with skills that are not needed, classic overproduction. But the producer, the schools, are insulated by the government from the economic risks of what they are doing. A cluster fuck for sure.
I say put the credit risk on the schools. Make them assess the student’s potential to repay. This will reduce the production worthless degrees as well as reduce tuition prices. It will also shrink the pie, less students going to college and some poorly run schools going belly up, which would be good for the overall quality of the system.
yes ^^
Well said and so true! The “endowments” of many of these universities are staggering! It’s criminal that they are not only tax exempt, but also that they are allowed to sit on that kind of money, acting as hedge funds (and pushing ESG, I’m sure). That money should be required by law to be used to fund, among other things, student scholarships and loans. Period.
Interesting, I never thought about it that way. These loans are clearly not underwritten to any standard. More progressive BS
Correct. Schools need to assume responsibility for the loan money they are currently receiving in full, up front, while they have zero stake in the game for its repayment. This has incentivized schools to drive up costs that the loans have to increase to meet, and they walk away with the money, while the student (aka "vehicle for the money") is stuck with all the risk and responsibility.
I'm a Democrat, but I opposed this "forgiveness" program because it does nothing to address the larger issues but issue a one time band-aid for those already stuck with the consequences. It should have come witsh more strings attached for institutions - both lenders and educational institutions - to bear the ultimate risks for defaults, to incentivize driving down costs and issuing loans on the supply side. And frankly, employers need to be reined in as well on their hiring requirements. If they demand 4 year degrees for everything above "fry cook" then they need to be spending the money to provide for that workforce.
Nailed it.
So much this!!
It’s hard to turn back the clock on a system that has allowed universities to raise tuition with no consequences for decades. It’s become a dog chasing its tail. The government should have never taken on loan guarantees - the universities needed to have some skin in the game. Not sure how to go back now.
Reduce demand. The world needs doctors, lawyers, engineers, and teachers (I’m sure the list can be expanded a bit), and those folks probably need a higher education. Most vocations don’t require it (even if those in the given vocation think that they do). Universities are businesses, and they turn out a lot of garbage products. Stop buying.
Any curriculum that ends with 'Studies' needs to be defunded. It's purely, in nearly all cases, indoctrination.
Are you better off with a four-year degree in business or four years of sales experience? With a four-year degree in literature or four years as a working newspaper reporter? With a four-year degree in music or four years of playing gigs? With the exception of physical sciences, math, engineering and medicine, I think most college degrees are a poor investment. Maybe law, but then do we really need to subsidize more lawyers?
Historically, university degrees were never supposed to be an economic "investment" at all. They are supposed to be for the brightest and most gifted to study the best ideas in the history of the world with the goal of becoming a more virtuous person who might have a few original thoughts in the course of his lifetime and maybe be able to use one of them to improve the world in some small way.
Where we went wrong was allowing our corporations to talk us into converting our universities into job training centers. We had apprenticeship programs and internships for that, but big companies like it better when someone else (taxpayer or student) picks up the tab for their future employees' training.
Love your first paragraph!
The second I think is a lesser cause.
This ^^
There is still enormous value in the "liberal arts". We just need to separate "career skills" from "academics".
Other than a few small schools, there's almost no one who actually teaches "the liberal arts" anymore, as in the study of the best ideas in the history of the world. Over the last decade, Hillsdale College has largely become the Harvard of classical school families for exactly this reason.
Simple: just set a degree-wide loan limit = average amount a person with your major makes three years after graduation. The kicker is that a person with a gender studies degree may be flipping burgers or brewing coffee. Those get averaged in as well. Can’t limit the wages just to the 7 people who find jobs studying gender.
Don't fool yourself. Every government agency and most corporations now have diversity, equity and inclusion departments with jobs for "studies" majors. They are well-paid obstacles to productivity.
Yes, but are there ~enough~ high-paying jobs to absorb all of the useless?
Not even close
Turn college loan policy back to the states and get it out of the federal government.. Most states would divorce themselves from the process, while Cali would guarantee all undocumented migrants 6 years of free tuition. But the ultimate solution is to get the feds out of that business.
During high school my son was the high school loan officer. He loaned money to selected students at 30% interest calculated weekly. We didn’t know at the time but we taught all our kids about finance and prudence, and all are financially stable adults.
He had hundreds of dollars in cash around his room when he left home because he understood the concept of delayed/denied gratification.
If an eighteen year old is ignorant of basic financial concepts that’s on the parents.
You are right but many of these parents, if a child even has a parent at home, are also financially ignorant.
True and that’s a terrible situation al the way around.
But it has nothing to do with age. It has everything to do with parenting.
Tell him I'm hiring :)
Since he’s leaving the military very soon he may take you up on that!
I've read through a lot of comments bemoaning loan forgiveness and making suggestions for dealing with debt. Not one person has suggested that students take a year or two to work and save money while living with their parents.
A diligent young person can save enough to cover the first two years' tuition, and co-op jobs can cover the rest. Why does higher education need to follow high school immediately?
The one-two years of work is a good idea for maturity and focus to be able to complete a four year degree in four years. Bless the heart of the student who assumes the luxury of dithering and being unfocused in college and needing 6 years or more to leave with loads of debt and no degree, because they will get bitten on their backside by loan repayment. It is also equally absurd that many universities do not guarantee that they will offer the classes needed to allow a student enrolled in a four year program to succeed in graduating in four years.
I had no idea that it was so bad in the US. It's much more organized in Canada.
Not sure how much you think tuition costs, but saving up $150,000 in cash in 2 years is quite an accomplishment (at $75k/year tuition).
How many students pay that out of pocket? At least students from lower income families. And who borrows $75 K per year for education that doesn't lead to similarly gainful employment?
There are plenty of students from wealthy families who pay these exhorbitant amounts for useless degrees. Students from families that didn't throw money around tend to get scholarships that cover most of the tuition.
That's my point - telling people to "work for a while to build savings and then pay out of pocket" is not remotely practical advice nowadays.
As a fellow Canadian, it's much better up here, but tuition rates in the US are just ridiculous.
The loans are too burdensome because college tuition has skyrocketed.
https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/2019/05/18/cost-of-college-the-year-you-were-born/39479153/
1971:
• Private tuition, fees, room and board per year: $2,930 (inflation adjusted: $18,140)
• Public tuition, fees, room and board per year: $1,410 (inflation adjusted: $8,730)
• Adults with a bachelor's degree: 11.4%
2017
• Private tuition, fees, room and board per year: $46,990 (inflation adjusted: $48,380)
• Public tuition, fees, room and board per year: $20,790 (inflation adjusted: $21,400)
• Adults with a bachelor's degree: 34.2%
That's what the combination of the federal student loan and the "everyone goes to college" mindset has made. And outside of engineering, does anyone really think the education these kids are getting today is superior to that of 50 years ago?
(and maybe medicine)
Don’t forget: Obamacare federalize the entire student loan process.
https://blog.independent.org/2018/02/04/surprise-obamacare-projections-on-student-loan-profitability-hit-a-snag/
I've heard a proposal to make loan amount commensurate with predicted income based on a student's chosen major major. Engineering? Maximum allowable, as this major predicts high income after completion. Gender studies (or any other major that leads to jobs involving fry oil and a small hat)? Minimum allowable, because that loan will never be paid. This might also return students to considering value rather than fads when it comes to higher education.
When gender studies, literature, philosophy, etc. is the educational domain of only the privileged few with trust funds that can afford to attend universities and not be concerned about a salary after years of expensive study then what is the result? Perhaps it is the current group of professors that are teaching at many universities who talk about social justice from gated communities; who understand that there is a need for John Kerry to use a private jet and their children to attend private schools; or can condemn an innocent baker of racism and accept a colleague that planned a genocide. Maybe, a few intellectuals "do you want fries with that" and saw the struggle and pride of their parents' hard work would bring a much needed honesty and evaluation to the "studies."
We need to construct and fund an educational system that heeds John W Gardner's advice when he wrote, " The society which scorns excellence in plumbing because plumbing is a humble activity, and tolerates shoddiness in philosophy because it is an exalted activity, will have neither good plumbing nor good philosophy. Neither its pipes nor its theories will hold water.”
What a brilliant piece of advice. Nobody needs a social justice professor when the sink clogs up.
Just a word of caution, engineering is made of of different fields, such as civil, mechanical, electrical and aerospace. There are employment booms and busts in those fields, and the curriculum in each is remarkably different.
Just as in medicine, where incomes vary wildly from pediatricians to neurosurgeons. None go hungry, though.
True enough, although there were a lot of unemployed aerospace engineers back in the day. And I knew some bitter civil engineers once.
The sign held by the young person on the left shows what we taxpayers got for paying his tuition: a love of dictatorship, zero rationality, and an inability to spell.
This would be funnier if it wasn’t so depressingly true.
I agree. It's not funny. It would be absolutely enraging if one really thought about it.
"poorer borrowers able to walk away from twice as much"
This phrasing is somewhat misleading. The $20,000 for borrowers who received Pell grants - "poorer borrowers," strictly speaking - means they had lower incomes at the time they attended college. It does not mean they are "poorer" now than other beneficiaries of this debacle or "poorer" than people without student loan debt.
I am a perfect example of this point. I started college late and was not a dependent and got a pell grant. Worked hard and my kids won't qualify for much of anything other than using the money we've saved for their education. We've covered pretty much all of it - probably too much. But, with inflation going as it is, it probably still won't be enough. Shrug - well, the ingrates ;-) need to have some skin in the game anyway...
We expect our children to go to college cheaply, community college followed by the local state university branch, or pay for their own college by joining the military, for example. Second son got Pell grants for a couple of years.
No one seems to consider the effect on military recruitment of cheap or free college for everyone.
Good point.
An excellent point. I was a "poorer borrower" in 1990, with a salary of 13K. My first job, in 2000, paid $175K. Should I not have been responsible for my debt? (Just to be clear, I paid it all off.)
Yes, "poorer at the time of borrowing" is different from "poorer now" or "poorer for life."
I think people should pay their debts, in general!
Thank you Nick for the round up. TGIF is one of my must reads and a highlight of my week. It is great to see the quality remains while Nellie is on maternity leave.
And because I was acclaimed a few weeks ago to do a sort of foreign correspondent's type (and it amuses me) here is this week's:
This is Northumberland UK calling 19 8 22
Guilt through familial connection has come for the noted abolitionist Edmund Burke. His brother apparently was involved in the slave trade. Thus despite his own record of campaigning against the slave trade and the excesses in India at a time when it was deeply unfashionable, the House of Commons will be listing his portraits and statue as having a ‘connection.’ https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/08/24/anti-slavery-mp-edmund-burke-put-transatlantic-slave-trade-register/
Is Big Brother already on campus in the UK? Reporting microaggression by app now exists in England. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/08/20/report-microaggressions-qr-codes-campus-lamda-students-told/
The Conservative Party Leadership Contest trundles on. It looks like Truss has just about trussed up Sunak. Hard to pretend to be a man of the people when you are married to one of the wealthiest people on the planet. This cartoon of Maybe lose the cushion says it all: https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/morten-morland-times-cartoon-august-25-2022-pdmdxst5r
However in an effort to save his campaign, Sunak has come out and said that he was silence about the lockdowns and the affects he worried about. Certain people like Johnson’s former advisor Dominic Cummings who had to go to Barnard Castle for an eye test and Lee Cain who enjoyed a party called Sunak’s word rubbish and wrong. Recollections differ. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2022/08/25/rishi-sunak-accused-spouting-dangerous-rubbish-criticism-no/
The guessing game of who will be Truss’s gatekeepers has already started. If Nikki De Costa gets one of the positions, her views on Identity politics are well known and she is closely aligned with Transgender Trend. Both candidates at hustings yesterday stated that a transwoman was not a woman. https://conservativehome.com/2022/08/25/trusss-number-ten-appointments-if-theyre-not-right-from-the-start-her-government-will-be-blown-off-course-and-may-never-get-back-on-it/
The Queen’s health continues to be fragile (she is in her 90s) and there are plans afoot to have the ‘kissing hands’ ceremony take place at Balmoral, rather than at Buck House where it is traditionally held. The Queen is currently on her 10 week stay at Balmoral. The Queen, however, will be the one to decide where this ceremony happens. https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/queen-may-appoint-new-prime-minister-at-balmoral-over-health-fears-ngmgkdz0s
Labour continues to be missing action, despite the massive strike action looming, even criminal defence barristers are going to be manning the picket lines in the coming weeks.
The cost of living crisis should play in Labour’s favour. The energy cap has increased incredibly (up 80% today) with many already struggling to pay its fee. Cue frantically googling energy saving tips. https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/energy-price-cap-calculator-bills-what-it-means-cbbxd3ppc
However, it does make it hard for certain poster people of the crisis and austerity living such as Jack Monroe, the Bootstrap Cook as this expose points out. https://medium.com/@AwfullyMolly/jack-monroe-saint-or-scammer-80ec92f37bb6
Rather allowing good produce to go waste, the discount grocery store announced that it would be selling stunted produce in its shops and called on other supermarkets to do the same. Oftentimes supermarkets have certain size requirements for fruit and veg. To cope with the cost of living crisis, more and more British consumers are turning to the German discounting giants of Lidl and Aldi. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/08/25/supermarket-sell-stunted-fruit-vegetables-avoid-waste-drought/
In Coercive Progressivism (love this term from Caitlin Flanagan!) overreach, an employee of the Gilded Balloon theatre decided to confront and verbally abuse theatre goers because he judged them to be gender critical feminists based on their appearance and that they were attending a comic performance about vaginas. The employee has now been moved to a different theatre where presumably he will not be confronted with middle-aged women enjoying themselves. https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/edinburgh-fringe-audience-harassed-by-venue-employee-in-trans-row-90jk2tjpc
Speaking of Edinburgh, the binmen are on strike, resulting mountains of rubbish, the sort normally seen Napoli when their binmen strike. This Matt cartoon says it all: https://twitter.com/MattCartoonist/status/1562477714627432450/photo/1
The literary spat of the summer involving the chairperson of the Society of Authors and a growing variety of authors continues. Author and creative writing professor Philip Hensher took umbrage on Monday to being told to ‘play nicely.’ Philip Pullman made several appearance on various twitter feeds, explaining he wasn’t sacked but quit in disgust. Kate Clanchy whose troubles on twitter caused Pullman to resign revealed that on the evening before the Society of Authors issued its ‘play nicely’, the chairperson was busy calling her the polystyrene packing of publishing. One suspects there will be more in the Weekend papers as the chairperson appears determined to keep on tweeting. This substack spills more of the behind scene letters and complaints which author after author sent in and the stock dismissive responses they had in turn. Many considered they were alone in their concerns rather than being united in their disgust at the handling of the situation. https://loobylou.substack.com/p/we-need-real-substantive-change-in?r=1ovpwt&s=w&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
Manchester United beat one of their arch-rivals Liverpool mid week which was a shock. They played like they were actually a professional team which has the ability to score goals. The transfer window remains open and much speculation remains about the deals still to be done before it closes. It happens every August, fills column inches and makes for pleasant conversation. https://www.telegraph.co.uk/football/2022/08/25/10-big-deals-could-still-happen-transfer-window/?li_source=LI&li_medium=li-recommendation-widget
Finally:
The mystery of the speeding car which never left the compound… so how was it photographed speeding? Answers on a postcard https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2022/08/22/mystery-couple-return-spain-speeding-fine-car-left-airport-meet/
Off to see if there are any more lights etc which can be turned off in the house, counting the number of quilts, blankets, wool hats etc which will be employed in the coming months and eyeing up the beeswax which needs to be made into candles.
Thanks for the report. God save the Queen!
I missed the part where we are now morally responsible for what our family members do.. but perhaps that’s only historical figures?
You know I wasn't given that memo either...
About all this… I feel like saying “they’re dead people, they don’t care what you think about them. Isn’t there something more productive you could be doing in the world than raking the past for sinners? Like knitting blankets, hats etc. for people; discovering new energy sources and so on?
I’m living the American dream. I’m the first person in my family to get a college degree, one I got after dropping out of high school due to serious lack of adult supervision. I’m nearly done with my masters degree. I’m happily married. We bought a home this year, with the co-signing but not financial help of my in-laws, because, how else are two teachers able to enter this market? I’m gainfully—no, joyfully employed. I’m a woman with all the rights and freedoms I could’ve ever dreamed. I’m reading this from the comfort of our leather L shaped couch surrounded by my dogs with a warm cup of coffee. This is it.
Right there with ya Shawna! Dropped out after 8th grade and hitchhiked cross country till 17. Got a GED and degree.
Don’t tell me it’s “impossible” because I’ve done it.
Same! My brother, sister and I- all first generation in our family with college degrees. My parents were both from broken homes and married as teenagers. They started working on their own education when I was in high school. All five of us cobbled together what we needed through grants, loans, scholarships, and WORK! Lots of work. We worked summers, weekends, evenings, Christmas break, spring break. My parents kept their full time “day jobs” and fit in classes where they could. We all chose colleges we could afford and degrees that were practical and employable. None of us finished with large debts and we were all able to get them paid off.
Love that. It’s amazing to me that my most “progressive” friends never had to work through college (took me 7 years with a full time job) and their parents covered the cost entirely. It’s almost as if…not earning things makes you skeptical of your own achievements and the context they occur in
Took me 6.5 years working full time and raising kids.
Couldn’t agree more re: not earning things.
I should add that I don’t think my story is unique. There must be a million different versions of this same story. I’m aware of many of them among my own friends.
👏👏👏
Shout out to America. As a legal immigrant who had my oath ceremony just yesterday (8/25) to become a naturalized US citizen (it was wonderful by the way) I have to say the American Dream will only die if Americans kill it.
A little background. I was born in Ireland, raised in England (both Socialist countries underpinned by capitalism or they’d never function), and I’ve travelled extensively in Europe. Because of work I’ve lived in Germany, the Caucasus, Baku, Azerbaijan (brutally oppressed by Communism until 1992, citizens still horribly treated as their government is still largely corrupt) and then lived 10 years in the Middle East under one of the most oppressive regimes in the world.
So for me as an immigrant now able to call myself a US citizen, I’d say to all naturally born Americans, thank your lucky stars you were born where you were born. By a mere accident of birth you have, if you recognize it, an amazing advantage over any one else born outside the US. Don’t let anyone tell you otherwise.
Remember, only Americans have the ability to kill their American Dream. Don’t do it.
I always look forward to TGIF, and this week was a delight! Excellent choice for filling in for Nellie (to whom I send best wishes). As a physician who financed my own education, I HAD to pay my loans or my medical license would be revoked. Having fulfilled my contract with my lenders, I dislike the idea of my tax dollars being used to pay the debts of wealthy collegians who can afford to pay their own way. I fully support loans and grants for students who qualify financially (which I did, for a $2,000/year Pell grant, as I was working for 2 years between college and medical school making a big $13,000/year). People making 6 figures? Not so much. I also felt the pain of tuition hikes, as my first year of med school, 1990-1, cost $7,500. My final year, 1993-4, cost $12,500. My rent only went up 3% per year, but tuition nearly doubled. Who is doing this math?
The American dream is alive and well for those with the ambition to seek it.
It’s those who are trying to convince everyone it should be handed out that I’m worried about.
“…even the poor have cars!”
Love it. Reminds me of the joke about the 1st grade classroom when the teacher has read the Three Pigs story. She asks the kids what they thought about the story, what someone would say if they were somehow inside it. Little Johnny—it’s always little Johnny, isn’t it?—says “Holy shit! A talking pig!”
Not much else goes on in the class for about an hour.
“We should neither be slutty nor prudish, but empowered and intentional.” Thank you for sharing this piece. I read it and subscribed. She was telling my story. It feels good to know I’m not alone.
Damned fine job, Nick. You have maintained the standard I have come to expect from TGIF.
Don't get me wrong; you're no Nellie. But who is, really?
Ummm, Nellie?
TGIF it’s Nick G! Great post! Love the snark and links