I do not fear any religion. I fear only those who commit atrocities in the name of their god. To breed violence and hatred is nothing unique to Islam...
True, any religion (or belief system really, other than perhaps Buddhism) can be twisted and used as a pretext for violence and even war. Islam is predicated on the very idea. Death to the infidels and claim their lands for Allah!
Even the most radical fundamentalist of Christians don't detonate bomb vests in a restaurant full of women and children, cut babies out of the womb and decapitate them, or violate and torture women in the most barbaric fashions imaginable.
And while the Catholics and the Mormons display a particular disgust for gays, and have worked even in conjunction to deny them civil rights, they have yet to tie them to chairs and throw them off of buildings.
It's not a question of degrees, it's a question of humanity. The concept is anathema to Islam -- whose very name means submission. Yours.
Sorry but most Christians accept homosexual people they are just unable to affirm something the Bible clearly indicated as a departure from Gods intent. Many Christians, well all, fall short, but we do not demand affirmation of our shortfall. Judgement belongs to God. In the interim ,we are to love our neighbors as ourselves and homosexual neighbors are included.
That's part of the Jewish Covenant, not yours. Where you find what you might twist in the New Testament it turns out to be interpolation derived from Leviticus. It isn't even ment in a moral sense from what I gather from Rabbis. You can't claim a god of love and be against love; you are just asking to be laughed at.
I believe the Buddhist angle is a new one in the past year in Myanmar. The coup leaders have attempted to recruit support from the monks, to add legitimacy to what they are doing, which is mass murder of mostly everyone they dont like. Pretty similar to Hamas and the Israelis, as well as numerous religious sects around the world.
What stops or slows the violence, is good people, with moral conviction to stand up to the atrocities that are committed. When they are committed, appropriate action is needed to send a message back to killers, such as what the IDF is doing to Hamas. Yes, some civilians are caught in the crossfire, but certainly the IDF is taking great pains, and personal risks, to try and protect civilian populations.
In the old days of school yard fights, the question was asked of all present, "who started it"?. you usually dont get the truth, unless all parties are in the same room, and history is laid bare.
When people talk about the violence of Christianity they’re talking a time when life everywhere was hard and people were barbaric. Every religion grew up, modernized, etc. Every religion except for Islam.
The history of christianity is even bloodier than what ISIS did. They burned tens of thousand of innocent people alive. There is no brutality that hasn't been committed at some point in the name of the christian god and don't forget the worst crime in human history, the holocaust, was committed by a Christian country.
Nowadays christianity seems somewhat tamed, but only because secularism broke its power. Under the surface the ugly side of religion is still alive in christianity too and is waiting to be unleashed again. It doesn't take much as we can see in the history of jewish people in Europe.
That of course doesn't excuse the horrific acts committed by islamists in our times. But we should never pretend our culture is somewhat better and superior because it's rooted in Christianity instead of islam. It's not. It's just different strains from the same source and in some centuries Christianity has been more bloody and in others islam.
You make several very cogent points, and indeed many crimes and horrid acts have been committed in the name of a Christian God. But you are making an enormous oversight in what I would label your false equivalency argument in that no where in the New Testament is violence advocated...and the primary precept of all Christianity is the command to love God and love one's neighbor as oneself. Whereas, the Quran explicitly condones and advocates both violence towards and treating "non-believers" as second class citizens.
Man is man. He is capable of terrible acts. But a religion can guide him to it, train him for it, promise him rewards for it, justify it.
(did anyone hear the phone call from the Hamas terrorist while he was killing in Israel, calling his mom and dad for praise with about a dozen Allahu Akbars in between. That was chilling.)
for one, I'm agnostic, have not special allegiance to any religion. But comparing what Islamists do today, to what Christians did 1000 years ago, is sort of the point. If you and I were talking in the year 1095, sure, we can condemn the crusades and similar, and say "this should stop immediately", but we aren't living then. What happened then is no justification for now, and any rational person should be able to look at it and say "this is wrong, and maybe it's driven by a religion that is still 1000 years out of sync with the rest of civilization". Maybe the Christian church had some blame in 1095, and maybe Islam has some blame (and responsibility) today. That is not illogical.
FYI the Quran (which contains the precepts, rules and instruction of Islam) actually endorses quite a lot of atrocities very specifically. So if I understand you correctly you fear Hamas and all the other Islamic terrorist organizations who commit atrocities in the name of Islam, but are okay with teaching that atrocities are "okay" just as long as you don't act on them?
What about those who turn a blind eye, or excuse, or donate to causes that then use that to fund those who commit atrocities in the name of Islam? They are united by a religion the supporters and the terrorists, and seem to start with a bias of support if something is done in the name of that religion.
No, dear Celia, fear of Islamists is irrational. The are lunatics and fiends but we should not fear them. Hatred of them, on the other hand, is perfectly rational.
But I don't think it's irrational to fear them. These are people who believe that it's *good* to rape, torture, mutilate, and murder. They are criminals of the worst sort. It is legitimately frightening to know that these people walk the earth, and that there are people here, in my own country, who support them.
You forget, according to the masses of uneducated people with privilege and those in countries with state controlled media facts don't matter and they think history beyond 75 years is irrelevant in the land Jews inhabited for over 3,000 years except when they were forcibly thrown out so who's land is it really........uh oh......logic (which will be ignored)
They don't know history of any length. That one moron who said the Palestinians were "Genocided" on October 7 deserves a special tall hat and a place in the corner of the special needs classroom for the end of eternity.
"You forget, according to the masses of uneducated people with privilege and those in countries with state controlled media facts don't matter and they think history beyond 75 years is irrelevant."
- Irrelevant? Well that depends on which issue/group you're talking about. ;)
I worked in Dearborn from 1980-90. I enjoyed the culture, and the restaurants. I have no idea when it became radicalized. It was mostly 2nd/3rd generation citizens who were proud to be citizens of the US back then.
No - you two NEVER get old! You guys are like F Troop reruns. I am still trying to figure out which one of you is Cpl. Agarn and who is the Chief of the Hickawi. 😂
To anyone on the left, history stops as soon as some mythical oppressed group they can use to advance vile power dynamics went from the oppressor to the oppressed.
To anyone on the right, history begins post 1965 and the only people who have ever been legitimately oppressed are white, heterosexual males. Rhetoric that's used to get people to vote against their own economic interest by ginning up hatred of "the Other," domestically and internationally, in order to maintain their vile power dynamics.
Yes. That explains all the "Confederate pride." Very dispassionate.
Advancing power to oppress those they disagree with? You mean like making it illegal to use roads/highways to leave the state to get an abortion? Or passing laws making it illegal to not do business with Israel? Or gerrymandering districts to deny black voters in AL? Or banning books that discuss race, gender, sexual orientation?
What on EARTH are you even talking about? History begins as far back as you care to go, all kinds of people have been oppressed, but today it is undeniable by people who do not lie to themselves that there is an anti-White straight male vibe emanating from Woke politics. Vote against our own economic interest by doing what??? Where do you GET this stuff?
What am I talking about? Things were fixed in 1965. That's "old shit" - what are you complaining about?.....but yes, lest talk about Muslim conquests in the 6th century
Hope folks are enjoying not having the ACA.....I mean "Nigger - - "..... I mean "Obama Care."
They want all history to be irrelevant if it doesn’t fit their narrative. They can disregard or flip something that happened yesterday if it doesn’t further the agenda.
Indeed, Jews are the indigenous peoples. Think of Israel as an Indian reservation in the aftermath of an endless "Trail of Tears". The Arabs are the colonizers who have conquered many nations. They possess vast resources and wealth, but are seething with rage that this little patch of land, the sole sanctuary for a tiny and long-oppressed tribe, is beyond their grasp.
No. They're seething with rage because jews are underpeople without rights in their religion. And that land was conquered for Mohammed in a dream. It is an outrage to see people Mohammed declared fit for death or servitude living free and doing BETTER!
This is what makes them enraged. It's the same kind of fury someone truly believing in KKK ideology feels seeing rich black people who are doing better. Even more rage inducing if those rich black people give them charity---which is demeaning.
Their Jim Jones type psychopath told them to kill everyone who doesn't convert or pay them to stay alive while they stand on their necks. Told them rape is good. Told them torture is good. Told them taking slaves is good. Told them it's a religious obligation to lie and to decieve with every stratagem of war. Told them to treat any who claim to be one of them that doesn't fight as worse than their enemy. Told them they are going to a whoreouse in the sky forever if they obey him.
I would agree slot of the hatred of Israel is their success. Palestine is a mess and Israel is a thriving economy. The left only likes struggling minorities. Asians in the US are the same. Their children achieve in school and warrant access to magnet schools and the best universities but are crowded out by affirmative action placements. It’s as the story identifies at the root is a toxic victim culture. The victim narrative is only possible if you paint Palestine as occupied, despite the fact that they are not. Or that Israel is a colonizer, even though they are on land that has been theirs since the the before the 6th century BC. We should discuss those colonizing Babylonians who took over Israel in the 5th century BC. Probably not. That’s way more than 75 years ago.
And we want Smyrna back too. If you haven't seen the movie Smyrna, that came out this year, it's another genocidal attack on Greeks and Armenians by the usual suspects.
The movie, Smyrna, made by really talented Greek filmmakers based on a diary, depicts life in Smyrna before, leading up to, and during the massacre. It's in Greek, French--the lingua Franca in the marketplace, English in diplomatic communications, and a bit of Turkish. As a Greek-American, I just cried. Obviously, we all know the end and I don't want to "spoil" it, but let's say, the modus operandi of the attack is familiar.
But wait, how is there is a 6th century Jewish synagogue in Gaza 🥸? My tenured college professor who cannot be fired and my social media feeds taught me all that land was Palestine and the Jews colonized it in 1948.............🧐 #therealturth #standwithIsrael #HamasIsISIS #stopbeingmanipulated #HamasIsTheRealOppressor #learnthetruth
I know, right. History being taught today in colleges and elsewhere is like me, who doesn't know crap about hockey, speculating on the Canucks future......
You should start posting that article to friends' feed.
I still don't understand the use of the word "colonizer" in this example. To colonize, don't you need a nation to begin with, and then conquer others and make them a colony that pays you taxes?
These activists see white Jews and think all Jews are white. Only whites can be colonizers in their world and dark-skin people colonized. Yes, it's that crude and ignorant an equation and it's rampant in institutions and corporations.
"Who are the real colonizers?"--that is the essential point--"Israel "stole" the land!" goes the cry from the religion that stole lands from the Infidel--the non-Muslims-- for over a millenium--yes, that's right, all you Westerners who were never taught the history of Islamic conquests or the treatment of the defeated Infidels: exile, conversion or death--and that choice was only afforded those who survived the atrocities, which in many cases exceeded in brutality even those of Oct. 7th. See, for example the Siege of Constantinople on Wikipedia, and scrolldown to atrocities section. See? Nothing has changed in 6 centuries; it is still the very same Islam.
sayeth the followers of a religion that conquered Spain, North Africa, Egypt, the Levant, the Caucuses, several Mediterranean islands and later Anatolia, Nubia and southeastern Europe from the Christians. From the Zoroastrians they conquered Persia and parts of Central Asia. From the Buddhists they conquered Afghanistan, other parts of Central Asia and Bangladesh. From the Hindus they eventually conquered most of the Indian Subcontinent.
In all of these cases, religious groups such as Christians and Jews, and later Zoroastrians, Hindus, Buddhists and other religions were given the status of "dhimmi" meaning they were officially protected by the Muslim government, but had to pay a special "jizya" tax and were not given the same rights as Muslims.
I was unaware that any people were considered to be people of the book and afforded second class status other than Christians and Jews. And Jews in Spain were treated abysmally.
"Colonizers must go" supporters don't want to know history; they want to utilize their latest argument to destroy Israel and the US--the two Western powers,
coincidentally, in Iran's sights.
Interesting it has taken $13 billion in Middle Eastern funds to 200 colleges and universities to re-educate American youth to think like Middle Eastern Islamists. Obama would have liked the idea of running America from the perspective of his father, who lived in a colonized nation (although not colonized by America--it didn't matter--the idea was that America was powerful and this was bad.
That idea undergirds the decolonization movement in the US today. It is so antithetical to self preservation and logic as to be literally mind-boggling. You can teach apparently anyone, anything, with a combination of propaganda and censorship.
Yeah, fighting and enslaving each other. But go ahead and romanticize the virtuous indigenous peoples. Anyone is better than someone from Western Civilization, right?
It can be difficult, without some sort of clue or broad-based comment to recognize written sarcasm. When spoken, tone of voice is indicative of sarcasm.
Apparently being somewhere first is very important to the virtue signallers--unless they are talking about Muslims, who have a doible secret exemption.
Jews make the point that they can trace their ancestry to the Hebrews who settled in the area around 1000 BC. Of course powerful neighbors waged wars on them, and they were exiled, but they kept coming back.
Then Islam burst out of Arabia and started conquering and subjugating everyone around them. Such a nice religion of peace. Once a land is claimed by Islam, its past is wiped away. Jews disagree. Palestinians don’t acknowledge this. They say history started in 1948. Very convenient narrative.
From 1948 until the 6 day war (1967) Egypt occupied Gaza with the exception of a year in 1957 right after the Suez Crisis (where Egypt blocked the Suez Canal in an attempt to destroy Israel) It was after the Suez Crisis that US/French/British governments stepped up to seriously arm/defend Israel to protect the Suez Canal. So the claim of Israel occupation can't start until 1967..........so roughly a 38 year occupation in which there was multiple wars and constant terrorism against Israel by various Muslim countries/organizations.
Especially the fullness of their written language--oh that's right, they didn't have one. The Western World brought civilization, culture and education to both the indigenous in the Americas and the Indians in India. The key to happiness is gratefulness.
I read a fascinating article in the NYT Sunday Magazine (MANY YEARS AGO) about cultures around the world that live above a specific altitude above sea level that actively spurn written language, basically because it can so easily be warped and weaponized. Wish I could find it, but I bet it was 20 or 25 years ago.
They probably did a much better job learning to respect nature and family elders, healing practices, and more - -but they were also very busy killing each others tribes in extraordinary ways. The Comanches in the US were feared because of their ruthless brutality and extreme violence, (and not above kidnapping babies). Because they did not overcome the Europeans, these practices are rarely discussed or highlighted - only their virtuous attributes. They could be as ruthless and brutal as the worst of the Europeans. Tends to get overlooked (although I grew up witnessing how badly many were treated in modern N America, that’s true, too).
IIRC, when the Comanches raided other tribes or settlers, the babies and men were killed. Women and teens were taken as slaves....sometimes, others they were all killed.
At least the native Americans (formerly knnown as Indians) appear to have been the original indigenous people. The Palestinians were not; the Muslims were not; indeed, they did not exist before the 7th Century, and were preceded by people of other religions who were overrun by invading Islamic armies.
Yeah right! As the little girl in the video said, let’s vacate the country, it might be hard ….maybe we can all settle in Mexico (I’m sure they wouldn’t mind, probably because they have had no past experience with colonialism 😳)
Why is Comprof so delusional? Does he have a problem with Pakistan too if he's offended by countries under a century old carved from new borders in an everchanging political and national landscape?
Nooo. Comprof has a problem only with certain groups because Comprof is an avowed racist and antisemite.
Lol. I have never said anything anti-Semitic or racist -and you cannot provide any evidence of such.
Btw, which "Semites" are you talking about? ;)
I am anti-occupation and intentional bombing of civilians. Which is not inherently anti-Jew....unless you think that is part of their nature, "Nuance & Context." :)
You can't answer my points because they're FACTS. So keep deflecting,. How many Muslim deaths have you protested in Yemen, in Syria:, in Iran? How many other wars raging right now do you open your big mouth about? None. Because you only look for attention when it's Jews and Israel. Tell me again how you're not a bigot?
You're all over the comments with your gimmicky bs. But it's clear you don't read, you don't research. You're lazy. Cmon, man. You clearly have the time. Take a break from the Jew baiting and divisive racist rhetoric for a second and LEARN something. What kind of a professor is anti-intellectial and a stranger to scholarly examination?
Unless you can present a coherent response here, you are simply embarrassing yourself.
Answered your points perfectly. Let me do it again:
1. You have provided no points. So, there is nothing to respond to.
2. Have never said anything racist/antiSemitic.
3. I open my mouth about many wars, issues, etc. - THIS one just happens to be the most popular right now. Spoke often about Ukraine. Why haven't you opened you big mouth about Myanmar?
4. Oh, so only speaking about the biggest current world event right now, and not say....Myanmar.
5, Everything I have said is 100% accurate. Which is why you cannot debunk any of it and have no recourse but to hurl ad hominem attacks and accuse people of being anti-Semitic. That is getting old. People aren't falling for it anymore.
Yes! You've convinced me Compost! You are the smartest and most well-read poster here! I fully agree with all of your points; in fact your utilization of the English language is second to none. I would say you "owned" the crowd with this last post!
Denying the real history for only the Jews might be considered just a weeee bit Antisemitic as is claiming Israel is intentionally bombing civilians.... When Hamas puts a rocket launcher in a school or hospital they must be destroyed and if you look you will see evacuation warnings are given by Israel but Hamas shoots Gazans who try to flee. Judaism predates Islam, the Jews inhabited the land over 3,000 years ago so who is occupying what exactly?
Well said. I'm not sure if you know, but Comprof has a reputation here for engaging people purely to get under their skin and using illogical round -about arguments to prolong painful pointless debate. I usually ignore him but I've had enough today of all the lies about Israel.
We all have known someone like Comprof in real life. They’re the little boys who chase girls around the schoolyard with snakes because that’s the only way they know to be the center of attention. Most grow out of it, but others, like our resident troll, are still so insecure and resentful that they actively seek out people to bait. Feel sorry for for Childprof, but don’t take his bait. It’s like wrestling with a pig: you get muddy and the pig likes it. I save my irritability for the guys trying to sell me a car warranty.
Yes. People were told to evacuate to the southern Gaza....which is also getting bombed.
Hamas shoots Gazans who try to flee? What evidence do you have of that? Says who? Israel?.....certainly couldn't be the Gazans, because they are liars.
Which fairly tale came first is irrelevant. Non-Jews and Jews both inhabited the land.
Nope -- everything isn't a weeee bit Antisemitic, just you (and sadly many others). We all know you will keep going with the nonsense, lies, misinformation, and misdirection. Time for more football.
Non-Jews--Muslims, stole the land during the period of the Islamic conquests. They had to have stolen it from the Infidel, because Islam did not exist there prior to the 7th century.
The Jews of Israel are not "occupiers" or "colonizers." They won the land in a defensive war, after they were attacked, and later agreed to Bill Clinton's terms of total withdrawal for recognition of its existence. Arafat reneged at the last minute and started an intifada. Hmm... The Israelis also fell for the BS "land for peace" deal involving Gaza, where they left the land unilaterally__24 hours later Hamas was firing rockets across the border. What's the saying? Fool me twice, go fuck yourself?
Theodore Herzl and his fellow Zionist disagree with you. Take it up with them.
Now, until people in the West Bank and Gaza allowed to do what the want without, trade freely, repair homes, etc. without having to get permission from Israel, it is what it is.
Don't think you want to go down the "broken ceasefire" road :)
"The Nakba, which means “catastrophe” in Arabic, refers to the mass displacement and dispossession of Palestinians during the 1948 Arab-Israeli war. Before the Nakba, Palestine was a multi-ethnic and multi-cultural society. However, the conflict between Arabs and Jews intensified in the 1930s with the increase of Jewish immigration, driven by persecution in Europe, and with the Zionist movement aiming to establish a Jewish state in Palestine.
In November 1947, the UN General Assembly passed a resolution partitioning Palestine into two states, one Jewish and one Arab, with Jerusalem under a UN administration. The Arab world rejected the plan, arguing that it was unfair and violated the UN Charter. Jewish militias launched attacks against Palestinian villages, forcing thousands to flee. The situation escalated into a full-blown war in 1948."
They can keep trying this forever
Can wipe out every single Gazan, man, woman and child....which actually might be for the best.
Either way. I don't care. But the facts are what the facts are.
"Theodore Herzl and his fellow Zionist disagree with you. Take it up with them." No, you explain how they disagree.
As for your following paragraph,"until people in the West Bank and Gaza allowed to do what the want without, trade freely, repair homes, etc. without having to get permission from Israel, it is what it is." To do what they want is to import weapons for the purpose of destroying Israel--not my opinion--their Charters, statements, newspapers, speeches, etc. As for the rest, they have repurposed many items designated for improving living conditions to use as weapons or tunnel building. So give it a rest until you have something meaningful to argue, huh?
Define "occupation" please. Does the land not first have to belong to some group other than the occupiers'? To which group do you refer and how do you support the ownership claim post WWI? And if you are going to use the "people's ancestors have lived there for centuries" even if "we lost the land to the Allies in the war" argument, how do you account for the Muslims making that argument when for well over a thousand years, their conquering armies insisted on death, conversion or exile, not giving even lipservice to the "rights" of the Infidels (non-Muslims) whose families had lived thre for hundreds of years?
When you are not allowed to live/move freely with out the approval of another countries military, you are an occupied people.
When that military can enter you community and place their soldiers in your house as their own personal residence, you are an occupied people.
When another nations military provides back-up to their citizens as they kill you, steal farmland, homes and attack villages with impunity, you are an occupied people.
When you are given numbered ID tags to wear around your ankle, or you have to pass military checkpoints, in order to work, you are an occupied people.
When your airspace and maritime space are not yours, you are an occupied people.
When you are not allowed to trade freely, repair homes/buildings, have access to clean drinking water, etc. unless another nation's military allows it, you are an occupied people.
Israelis can vote for what happens to the Palestinians. Palestinians cannot vote for what happens to Israelis.
So, there is an occupation. The only is issue is what you choose to use are using to justify it. (WW2, ancestors, etc.) J
Just because prison guards don't live in the cells with the prisoners, doesn't mean those prisoners aren't incarcerated.
Muslim cultures/communities don't pretend to be democracies. Israel does. So, Israel can either (1) continue to try and keep this up in perpetuity or (2) kill all of the Palestinians.
It appears that they've finally got a free runway to do what I'm sure they've wanted to do for a long time and are going with #2.
Fine. Have at it. Let's just get it over with, so they can start paying for their own national defense.
Comprof2.0, I agree we should absolutely deal in only facts that are supported by evidence, so let's do that.
1. It is ahistorical to apply recent meaning to terms used more loosely in the past. Herzl's use of "colony" and "colonial" should not be confused with how those terms are used today. He was, in fact, emphatic that Jews not "infiltrate" Palestine. Rather, "Should the Powers (international community) declare themselves willing to admit our sovereignty over a neutral piece of land, then the Society will enter into negotiations for the possession of this land." This explains why so few Jews emigrated prior to statehood; Herzl was explicitly anti-colonial in the sense it is used today.
2. As there was no U.N. at the time, Herzl lobbied Britain, Germany, Italy/the Pope, and the Sultan of Turkey repeatedly. It was clear the Ottoman Empire was ending and the Middle East was going to be apportioned. The Middle East was indeed primarily Arab when Israel was established. And you have correctly pointed out that resident Arabs were not consulted about its formation. However, they were not consulted about any apportionment decisions, so I'm not sure why that's relevant. The international community created Israel as both a form of reparations for the Holocaust and as a way to get rid of their own refugee Jewish populations. Was it theirs to grant? Arguably not. But the pre-Nakba land was in fact purchased and Israel isn't going away, so let's move on.
3. Your biggest historical error is to claim Israelites started the War for Independence. This is patently untrue. Inhabitants of the rejected Palestinian state attacked first, only to be joined by the other Arab nations.
4. The Arabs living on that land both fled and were expelled. Just as I believe the creation of Israel would have been very unlikely if Jews were successfully assimilated in the Diaspora, I believe the Palestinian national consciousness would not exist had they been granted citizenship in the places to which they fled, had they been housed, fed and clothed. Are these Arabs also worthy of reparations? Yes! By whom? Now we can start the debate. That debate must include the property loss experienced by the 800,000 Arab Jews who fled and were expelled from Iran, Syria, Lebannon, etc. and whether the two-state solution is reparations enough.
5. You, like so many, seem unable to move forward because you cannot accept facts without what-about-ism. Hamas seeks the destruction of Israel, the death of all Jews, and the conquering of all non-Islamic peoples. They are imperialist and genocidal. Period. Does it matter that they have written it down and indoctrinate their youth? Absolutely. Poll after poll attests to the widespread acceptance of their ideology within Gaza and the West Bank. We must assume Palestinians have agency like any other people. Do we excuse non-abolitionists as being merely products of their environment?
6. Ultra-Orthodox Jews are supremacist and nationalist. According to them, there is no place in Israel where Arabs are welcome. Bad, but if we're being honest, not quite as bad. A quick survey of the literature attests that most Israeli children are taught a more nuanced and even-handed picture of mid-east conflict. The ultra-orthodox are not required to participate in civil society and so are far more indoctrinated. I hold them equally accountable for their abhorrent views and behavior. Israel must root out its fundamentalist elements. I am hopeful things are headed that way -- because Israel is a democracy.
7. Finally, intent matters. If you think there is no difference between manslaughter and murder, I cannot help you. And if your ethical viewpoint is purely utilitarian, where only numbers matter, the debate ends here. I am an unapologetic deontologist. I believe in universally applied principles.
1. Were the majority of Zionist who est. the state of Israel Ashkenazi Jews from Europe? Yes or No?
2. Did Theodore Herzl, et. al communicate/work with the British in what he described as a Zionist "colonial project" in regards to establishing the state of Israel? Yes or No?
I can direct you to Theodore Herzl's communication with the British where he defined/described the creation of Israel as a colonial project/endeavor. So, take it up with him and rest of his crew.
Maybe they should just stop occupying Gaza and the West Bank first, then they can take on bigger tasks.
No need to direct me anywhere - your comment provides the answer. Tell me how is Israel occupying Gaza if it withdrew from there in 2005? Hmmm. Seems like Hamas is the occupier since they do nothing but damage to their own people. As for West Bank - hmmm - tell me why it’s an occupation again?
Why didn't I listen to you???? If Comprof2.0 isn't a bot s/he truly has an incredible gift for being completely immune to reason. Take this statement, which seems to make sense at first but then you realize how each phrase is a non-sequitur: "Muslim cultures/communities don't pretend to be democracies. Israel does. So, Israel can either (1) continue to try and keep this up in perpetuity or (2) kill all of the Palestinians." It's just so bizarre. How does a bot learn to be non-sensical AND hostile???
maybe if they stopped shooting rockets at Israel, then Israel wouldn’t need to protect itself by a blockade and extra security on who it lets in as workers.
I mean, if every other neighbor you let into your house tried to attack you, wouldn’t you start taking precautions?
Funny you have no comment about Egypt, who also has a blockaded border with Gaza, and unlike Israel, wouldn’t give any work visas to Gazans so they might enjoy some measure of prosperity not provided by their own despotic government, run by fundamental islamists who after embezzling billions in aid money money meant for the people, live in luxury with other despots in Qatar and holiday in Turkey.
Comprof- the 15 million people of Israel don't care what you think. They live in a country that has an uninterrupted Jewish presence that has been a sanctuary for Jewish refugees not just from Europe but North Africa and other Middle Eastern countries in 1948 and onwards. Over the decades it has been a sanctuary for Jews escaping the kind of danger, harassment amd discrimination you advocate for againstus. Israel can let in who they wish. Your genocidal views are not relevant ro a country that has turned desert and swampland into a thriving and productive oasis of human rights and innovation.
Why is it so hard for you to pick up a history book? And do you really have a job? You are all over the comments sections. Or maybe Hamas is paying you to be their mouthpiece. Great gig.
"the 15 million people of Israel don't care what you think."
- And I don't care what they think. Although they are NOT happy with Netanyahu, which is progress.
For the rest of your stuff.....blah....blah....blah....
How about Israel just stop occupying people and allowing dual-citizenship setters to murder Palestinians, take their land, burn their homes, etc. without consequence? Pathetic you think that is genocidal or means someone is working for Hamas. Sad.
Israel is an ethnocracy, not a democracy. A state where Jews are at the top of all societal structures while non-Jews (Arabs, Gentiles, etc.)
Yep. Do have a job. Pays very well. I don't work on the weekends.
Are you a complete ignoramus? Israel is the ONLY democracy in the Middle East and the only one where apartheid is NOT policy.. 21% of its population are arabs who have full rights and protections as every other citizen. They have more rights in fact, than arabs anywhere else in the middle east and all the parts of Africa arabs colonized. Facts.
Your other stupid accusations about Israel acting with impunity without consequence defy every piece of evidence on record. How about you sit down with a map and Google Arab pogroms, Yassir Arafat, the Partition Plan, the amount of times the Palestinians have been offered their own state, and do something useful on your day off.
Funny how the Muslim "ethnocracies", which kicked the Jews out before there was an Israel, don't seem to bother you. Or ever mention how these wonderful people treat women__ or gays, torturing them or throwing them off of rooftops. Or the fact that the Grand Mufti leader of the Palestinians implored his buddy Hitler to murder all the Jews who lived in the area. Or how you never mention the Hamas charter, which is a handbook for genocide. You're a woman. The only place you'll be treated as an equal in the Middle East is Israel. It's like gays supporting Hamas. A sad joke.
Talk to Theodore Herzl et al. who had many communications with the British to work with them in what he and his fellow Zionists referred to as the "colonial project" to establish the state of Israel.
Until the people in Gaza and West Bank are allowed to live/move freely without Israeli approval, it is what it is. - no matter how you spin it.
Indeed they were after 6 Million of them were slaughtered so they sought refuge in the land that has been the land of the Jews for over 3,000 years and at the time most of it was arid and uninhabited and at the time was a British colony after it was part of the Ottoman empire and other empires before that. You fool no one but yourself.
Wait.....how could it be the "land of the Jews" it was part of the Ottoman empire and other empires before that? :)....how could it have been a British colony from 1917-1948 if it was "the land of the Jews?" How could there have been "Palestinian Jews" pre-1948 if there was never something known as "Palestine?"
If you knew history AT ALL, you would know that it was the land of Jews from the time of Abraham. Then the Jews all went to Egypt to escape a famine and ended up as slaves for about 400 years. Then in the 13th century BCE then went back to the land of Israel and conquered it from foreign peoples with Joshua. Over the centuries, remnants of Jews remained the land but various foreign powers conquered the area and carried off many Jews to Persia, (Susa and other cities), to Babylon, etc. Which is partly how the Jews got scattered. Eventually Rome took over the area but a Rome saw it as the “land of the Jews” and that’s clear from extra-biblical texts of circa 1-100AD. Remember Islam wasn’t even created until 600s AD. So that explains (1) how Israel was the land of the Jews way before any Muslims took over and (2) why Jews became scattered away from their homeland.
In 1000, Jews were precisely 1-2% of Palestinians. In 1914, Jews were 8%. In 1948, after decades of immigration funded by European Zionists, Jews were still less than one-third vs Muslims two-thirds. It’s crazy to argue that because Jews dominated the region thousands of years ago they or the UN somehow had a right to create an “Israel” in 1948. It had been Muslim territory for far more than 1,000 years.
Returning Jews bought back land in Palestine from Muslims. So, Muslim sold their land to Jews. It wasn’t viewed as worth much at the time. But then those pesky Jews developed it into valuable real estate, embarrassing the Muslims.
A two state solution was offered, Jews accepted, Palestinians didn’t. Then there were two, or was it three, wars over disputed land. Muslims lost. Who gets to claim ownership of land when your side lost so many times? And their Muslim neighbors? They want no part of them.
Muslims have a history of conquering lands and trying to wipe out the past of the conquered. They can’t do that with Jews, even in Gaza. Another poster provided a link to an article about a pre-500, ie, pre Mohammad, synagogue in Gaza.
Just to be more historically correct, people in that land first were pagan, worshiping idols. Jews invented new monotheistic belief and were prosecuted and expelled from land by Babylonians, Persians, Greeks and Romans. Some carried on with their Jewish beliefs in exile for ever, some in 1st AD converted to Christianity, believing in Jesus Christ, who was a Jewish rabbi. In 7th century Islam started to spread from Arabian peninsula and came to Judea and Samaria forcefully converting mixture of population who lived there. Some were ethnically Jewish too.
That may work in the socialist republic of Los Angeles, but good luck trying to pull that off in Miami. Especially when wearing a Castro hat. I'm surprised the speaker wasn't chomping on a cigar.
It’s just like BLM all over again…probably funded by the same people…probably the same people behind the megaphones 🤷♀️🙄 I second that the ignorance is mind numbing and astounding.
The woman who asserted that the Palestinian 'genocide' started on the very same day Jews were being murdered in Israel wins the grand prize for being the most deluded and incoherent of them all - though the girl calling for the decolonization of America came close.
Those were the two that stuck most in my mind as complete imbeciles. The term, Useful idiots, is a pretty good explanation of how they promote such a bankrupt ideology. The guy at the end of the video was perhaps the most chilling. He was very cautious in his response, but you could feel the venom in his responses.
"It's not about the Jews, it's about colonizers and the colonized."
Sell that story to someone dumb, protestors. It's about the Jews. If you were remotely interested in the other, you'd have been protesting every other nation on the face of the Earth. You picked Jews, and only Jews, because you think they can be pushed around.
I strongly believe what Bari and others have discussed before - Jews are the canary in the coal mine and have frequently been target first when major political upheavals and danger first starts. They are small in number and not prone to violence so get targeted more easily - but what starts with the Jews doesn’t end with the Jews. This political tension reflects trouble brewing in many ways across the globe. The Jews have often been among the first to sound the alarm. Look at these crowds, so ignorant most of them. Would not have any clue what to do or where to start when their group becomes the next target of hate and irrationality.
I agree with you except for “ you picked Jews and only Jews because you think they can be pushed around”.
That is not why they pick on Jews. The rabid Jew hatred we are seeing is something much deeper and more poisonous. It is age old blight on humanity that metastasizes through the ages. Early on it was against the Jews as a religion, then it was Jews as a culture, now it is Jews as colonizers ( zionists).
Anti Jew hatred unites groups that have nothing else in common( far right and far left , gays marching for Hamas! ,feminists not condemning the brutal gang races of Jewish women and marching for Hamas. Many many of these people are intelligent well read people. Antisemitism is an ancient evil that is resilient and dangerous and has nothing to do with IQ or bullying.
A mutual hatred of Jews is also the only thing with brings Sunni and Shite Muslims together.
edit: I would disagree with your assessment of these people as "intelligent and well read". To me they represent the exact opposite. They are very *selectively* read in that they only ever present a single viewpoint of any issue. And truly intelligent people seek to at least understand different perspectives even if they strongly support a single view. These people are mindless sheep. Very dangers mindless sheep.
It's the same logic by which, depending on the speaker, we are corrupt capitalists or die-hard communists.
Jew haters have never needed logic. The cool/funny thing is, all those great empires that tried to exterminate us.....where are they today (dustbin of history)? Yet this minuscule percentage of world population is still here and thriving, despite the efforts of those long gone empires.
We Jews are so deeply grateful to those who see the hatred for the ugliness it is and support our right to exist. Having Israel is vitally important for all Jews both in Israel and the diaspora.These last five weeks have been a nightmare I knew was always possible but hoped I would never see.
I'm an evangelical Christian, not Jewish, but I grew up with a Jewish boy in my grade whose parents survived WWII. They were the nicest family. I studied at Hebrew Union College when I was at USC in my undergrad years, and I pledged a Jewish sorority at SC. I'm sure there is a Jewish person out there I wouldn't like, but in all these years I haven't met one. I can't understand antisemitism at all, it just doesn't register.
We are seeing the results of years of indoctrination “ capitalism is bad “, “western culture is bad”...etc and Jews are easy scapegoats. Most civilized countries destroyed themselves from within. Maybe we are witnessing the collapse phase?
Also for a group of people who sure love to say America is bad and we should embrace other cultures ideals, they sure love applying America's colonial narrative to every other nation on Earth. Israel never had the Mayflower lolol.
Shane, the quote you started with could only have easily come out of the mouth of a person representing a profession I suspect was quite numerous in that demonstration: a college professor.
Actually, I think the reality is even worse: more than likely, most of them would be the first to succumb to, be offed, in this new world order they so stridently advocate - this goes 100x for the sexual/gender outliers; the homosexual, the queer, the transsexual, anything that does not rigorously conform to the male-female, extremist PATRIARCHY of Islam. But this doesn’t just follow for the Islamist fascists, my understanding has been that divergent views in anything is quashed by these repressive ‘isms.
What has always been so riotous to me is that these, to me, digressions from the norm have all arisen and "flourished " in those societies that are western, economically diverse, Christian historically,-- all societies they wish to destroy.
"it sure would be nice if we could say with a straight face that Israel’s current government has pursued nothing but peaceful coexistence with its Palestinian neighbors."
That's true for Israel's current government, but Israel has been trying to make peace with Palestinians--and give them the land they claim they want for their own state--since 1967. Pali leaders, most notably Arafat, responded with The Three Nos.
If Palis want peaceful co-existence--hell, I do too--they need to find leaders who will bargain in good faith, make the deal, and built their state already.
And ask the nice Jewish neighbors for cups of sugar, not fuel for Hamas rockets.
I listened to Lex Fridman interview Jared Kushner. He said there is Arab and non Arab money willing to invest in rebuilding Gaza so Palestinians can have lives and prosper. The obstacle? Hamas.
This convinced me that Palestinians are just worthless pawns, cannon fodder of their own fellow Muslims. I wonder if deep down they know this, but can’t face the fact so blame the Jews.
Yes Palestine is the only “country” that has its own UN refugee organization. So much money has gone to trying to give them humanitarian aid— and Hamas and other corrupt leaders have taken most, if not all, of it.
When are we gonna learn that we cannot keep giving money that ends up in Hamas’s hands?
If the Muslims are in such solidarity with each other, then why hasn’t Jordan or Egypt come to help Palestinians or helped Palestine refugees escape? Everyone is all up in arms about the bombing of a refugee camp in Gaza— but they don’t ask the question: why hasn’t there been more effort made by Hamas or Arab leaders to find new homes for these refugees? Why hasn’t another Muslim country taken them in?
I agree, it seems like the Muslim world is content to let Palestinians be the sacrifice needed to justify their jihad. Palestinians should be angry not at the Jews but at their fellow Arab Muslim counties who do nothing to help and only propagandize their sacrificial deaths for their own agendas.
If you look into why Arab nations won't take in Palestinian refugees, the reason is two-fold:
First, forcing Palestinians to remain refugees is a way of insuring there will always be an excuse to try to destroy Israel. This was a major factor for many years, because until Israel had defeated them in battle several times, the surrounding Arab countries were in a constantly attitude of war against Israel. This is becoming less significant as the leaders of more Arab nations have realized that Israel simply isn't going away.
Second, Palestinians have proven themselves to be very harmful immigrants wherever they have been allowed to go in the Arab world. They tried to assassinate the King of Jordan. They took over the southern part of Lebanon and continue to engage in civil war. Palestinian immigrants in Kuwait supported Iraq's invasion of Kuwait. And they support the Muslim Brotherhood, which is why Egypt wants nothing to do with them.
Thanks for this, Maureen. I believe Kushner is correct--if Palestinians could find a leadership willing to make a deal with Israel for a State of Palestine, there would be all kinds of global money flowing in to help them turn the place into a wonderland. If Palis can't find those kind of leaders, than the much bigger Muslim family needs to step in and do it for them. The terrorism hurts them all, so they all need to fight it.
The murder cults of Islam--Hamas, Hezbollah, ISIS, Islamic Jihad, etc.--will not abide by a State of Palestine that does not replace Israel and become part of the Caliphate they want to restore. They will actively fight Israel AND any Pali brave enough to say, "Not in my name, Hamas." These jihadists hate modern and moderate Muslims as much as they do Jews, and murder them with as much glee.
Israel, even with U.S. backing, can't win that fight on its own. The only counterweight to Iran and the jihadists is the Muslim world, which needs to band together to crush the jihadists not just to protect Palis, but themselves, who are also targets of the murder cults. There were signs of that happening with the Saudi-Israel talks, which is why Hamas launched its massacre--they saw those signs too and knew that if peace reigned, they'd disappear.
As terrible as this crisis is, it is also an opportunity: back-channel as the war rages, make the two-state deal, form a Middle Eastern NATO against the terrorists and Iran, and start doing business with both Israel and New Palestine. The jihadists are a danger to the Saudis and Jordanians, too, and it's time for the region to deal with it.
i think back channeling the Saudi-Israeli-US deal during this war is not only doable, but necessary. It looks like, and I hope I'm not premature, that the American military presence is forcing Hezbollah to stay put, and that the crisis in Gaza remains local. And if it remains containable, I think the Saudis can commit to (very) quiet negotiations to continue their entente with Israel. Saudi Arabia is no fan of either Hamas or Hezbollah - and will happily steamroller over them if given the diplomatic space.
Agreed. I'm no fan of Bonesaw Arabia, but it's big, powerful, has American weaponry, and is a very good counterweight to Iranian aggression. If it has finally tired of the Palestine bullshit it helped foment all these decades and wants the problem to disappear, more power to it. May the back channels prove profitable for all except Iran and the assassins it employs to even the Arab world's detriment.
Some say SA is playing games, but I thought it significant that the biggest players in the region--SA, Jordan, etc.--all vetoed a resolution at last week's Arab States conference calling for a total severance of relations with Israel. SA talks tough about Israel, but it's quietly working in Israel's favor. We'll see what's real and make-believe as this war continues, methinks--I do believe that great change can come only from great crises, and maybe this crisis is so huge that the Arab nations will force the issue on Palestine.
I believe the war will be contained to Gaza, in part because the Arab states dislike the Islamic death cults more than they dislike Israel. They can do business with Israel, and the death cults want SA and other states to die in favor of Caliphate-like versions. My only real worry is that if Israeli "settlers" keep murdering West Bank Arabs, that will provide the death cults an excuse to start up a second front in the Bank.
"Bonesaw' is an apt description of SA - but of course, we can't let perfection be the enemy of the good. We need the Saudis to throw their indelicate weight around, they're transactional and practical. They and Israel have a common enemy in Iran and that alone should compel them both to stay at the negotiating table.
Your worry re the West Bank is real. The settler issue has been the thorn in the side of a realistic settlement for two decades. Only when Netanyahu and his right wing coalition is gone can we even see a glimmer of hope there - but not before, imo.
They are taught more than to blame the Jews. UNRWA teaches them to hate and kill Jews. Hence the recorded audio from 10 -7 of the jihadi calling his parents back in Gaza-bragging that he killed ten Jews “ tell mom she’ll be so proud”. This is not an exaggeration . When this war is declared over the task of deprogramming this culture must begin if there is ever to be a chance for peace.
Listening to that Nasrallah ‘s rant today I think “ this man is a hateful misogynistic arrogant sack of shit.
Iran heading the human rights council at the UN
Assad the man who used ricin on his own people talking about human rights to Israel the only democracy in the Middle East
As with any group it is not a monolith. Some know it some don’t. Until the Palestinians give up the delusion of their refugee status and accept the right of both Jews and Palestinian arabs( both Muslim and Christian) to live side by side in the land , there can be no peace. I urge people to read and watch ( YouTube) Einstein Wilf Phd on this topic. She is an Israeli intellect, politician with deep roots in the peace camp. She spoke this past week to a group on Capitol Hill ( rec on YouTube) . Please watch and share your thoughts with me
The fact that you say “this convinced me that Palestinians are worthless _______” it doesn’t even matter the rest of the sentence. This is the red flag for me that somewhere there is rot in the narrative that is justifying the mass killing of Gazans for the past month. Grossly disproportionate to anything that ostensibly provoked it. I never knew much about the history of the region before a month ago but have been looking into it, reading and listening to both sides and find SOOO many gaps in the story-telling I now read on places like this. THIS is how humans become convinced that a genocide is ok and look away. THIS is what “never again” refers to. It takes discernment to get at the truths that matter most. There are always “reasons,” always justifications for things like what is happening right now to Gaza. Always. And it sounds right from a certain angle - from a certain lense. For me there is enough that echoes in the mistakes of history to see that the state of Israel IS the oppressor and what they are doing to Gaza is wrong. The Zionist project is wrong and this is its logical conclusion.
Everything about a protest - the judgment and character of the people there - doesn’t have to be perfect for its underlying truth to be salient. I protested vaccine mandates at rallies with some speakers who I cringed about and did co-sign with, made me unsure attending was the right call. But the cause was the right cause. We were right about the injustice we were calling out. So are the pro-Palestinian protesters.
How is Israel an oppressor when (1) they have a longer claim to the land than Palestinians and (2) Arab nations have started every single war since day 1 of Israel’s creation?
As far as “justifications” for the war in Gaza— how do you expect Israel to act when they have been putting up with a hostile region in Gaza since 2005 and then from most recent Oct. 7th attacks?
Is self-defense not a good enough reason for you? What would “proportional” force look like, in your mind, against a maniacal death cult that encourages women and children to die for their cause? How does Israel engage an enemy that continual hides their military operations in schools, hospitals, and mosques?
Someone (sorry can’t recall who at the moment) recently said (paraphrase): if Hamas laid down their weapons tomorrow, there would be peace. If Israel lies down its weapons, there would be no Israel.
Any “mass” to the killings of Gazans this past month is 100% on the terrorist group of Hamas, NOT on Israel. If you think otherwise, you either have listened to too much Arab propaganda about the situation OR you really misunderstand the international rules of war and what it takes to stop terrorism.
Oh yes. And I WILL judge the character of these idiots who don’t know history and who justify terrorism. I think justice requires we do cast judgement on those who want to both apologize for acts of terror and who essentially say that all Jews in the world should be dead.
Is your comment even worth replying to? “ostensibly provoked?” Do you need to see, eg, a video of a Hamas guy beheading a Jew with a shovel and then sending a photo to the victim’s mom? And then the Hamas guy phoned his own mom and bragged with glee about what he had done? What justification can you offer for THAT?
You claim ignorance, OK you have a lot of catching up to do.
here’s a tiny sampler of perspective.
Hamas, HAMAS, uses Palestinians as human shields. Schools and hospitals are used to house ammunition. Why? why not have depots of ammunition so if your enemy needs to blow up your ammo, no children or sick people are put at risk? Because HAMAS doesn’t give two shits about Palestinians. To them they are worthless. If they get bombed, it’s a good thing, because Hamas gets sympathy from uninformed people. Like you.
Today Israeli soldiers were escorting Palestinians out of Gaza, giving them safe passage. Israeli soldiers put themselves at risk to protect Palestinians. Did you hear?
Before 10/7 Israel had increased the number of Palestinians allowed in to Israel to work. Unemployment in Gaza is 50%. Looks bad for Palestinians to be getting jobs from Jews, huh?
HAMAS has controlled Gaza since 2006 and nothing has been done to improve the lives of those people. The leaders live in luxury in Qatar and rob the people of billions in foreign financial aid. Cement and piping to construct housing is taken to make hundreds of miles of tunnels and bombs. Those tunnels have been dug into Israel, under day care centers. So they can bomb little Jewish children.
One more thing— it was the Palestinians who refused the two state solution offered in 1948. They lost three wars since. Bad decision on their part.
They just don’t care; they start from a place where Israeli Jews are bad, but they don’t admit it—perhaps not even to themselfes, assuming they are who they purport to be online, a big IF; then they read garbage to justify their initial bigotry and come out sounding like an even handed person.
Disproportionate my ass. Read about Nagasaki and Dresden. Totally justified. War is hell. If you don’t like your people dying, don’t start a fucking war. Case closed.
Evidently you are not aware that every Arab country that has offered refuge to Palestinians has ended up regretting it. When a group of people behave consistently in a way that causes even their Muslim brethren to want nothing to do with them, rushing to take their side because they're being disparaged and attacked (in a war they started) is naïve.
If you really stopped reading at the word “worthless” and didn’t finish with the rest of her statement you missed her point entirely. She said worthless cannon fodder for their fellow Muslims, not to herself personally.
In response to all the incredulity at my comments, I will simply share what I have been reading and listening to. It would be impossible to respond to it all. After having learned more about the history, the configuration of the map (land from non-Jews being slowly taken over TO THIS DAY), the lack of rights for even Israeli citizens that are not Jewish, I think anyone who takes an honest look can see how the state of Israel is an oppressor.
As for where I am learning my information (besides my initial introduction from my paid subscription to The Free Press)
- I just finished reading Miko Peled’s (the son of a decorated IDF general who fought for Israel both in 1948 and 1967) book The General’s Son - finally finished it last night. 90% of the people whose voices I have been listening to in order to inform my opinion are Jewish. Many of them have close ties to the holocaust which informs their take on victimization.
I have great respect for who recognize that an ethnostate like Israel doesn’t automatically represent them and shouldn’t, and are decrying the decimation of Gaza saying “Not in my name.” As a Christian, I have a similar feeling. One young (Jewish) man who is an active member of Jewish Voices for Peace says he grew up in the Midwest where the majority of Zionist he lived around were Christian Zionists. He says there are more Christian zionists in the world today than Jewish people. This makes me cringe as I understand the romantic impulse to interpret scripture in a way that confidently believes the modern state of Israel is a god-ordained project.
One of the first things I read in The Free Press on October 8 was the article about the famous Ecclesiastes chapter 3. I thought that was a great idea and proceeded to read the whole book of Ecclesiastes over the next few days. My biggest takeaway was a verse from chapter 7: “it’s best to stay in touch with both sides of an issue. A person who fears God deals responsibly with all of reality, not just a piece of it.”
Funny how Israeli people are allowed to be critical of government policy - but Palestinian people never express the same regrets of government policy publicly re: Hamas and Fatah.
Did you happen to "research" a timeline of more than 75 years? Just curious.
And did you happen to come across in your "research" the amount of colonizing and settling in Syria and Algeria and Egypt and Persia and Afghanistan that forced EVERY SINGLE JEW to get up and leave THEIR ancestral homelands? Who should be held accountable for those GENOCIDAL APARTHEID WAR CRIMES?
Did you happen to come across in your "research" the 1947 partition plan endorsed by the United Nations, and agreed to by Israel... but rejected by every single Arab nation?
Did you happen to come across in your "research" which Arab nations welcomed the Palestinian "refugees" with open arms after 1948?
If you have the chance, read about Israel being attacked in 48, 67 and 73. It really does seem like God protected them. It is astonishing that they survived.
Which specific lack of rights for citizens who are not Jewish do you mean, and didn you ever notice how many Muslim nations have zero non-Muslims allowed, not only disallowed to be citizens or live there as non-citizens, but Jews cannot even enter, and you quibble about some rights someone told you non-Jews lack in Israel?
Abbas says in his new state not one Jew will be allowed —but that’s just fine with you? What a load.
It's not that hard to find fairly neutral pieces on Arab rights in Israel. This is pretty good and from what I would consider to be a reliable source: https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/what-know-about-arab-citizens-israel. My only real complaint about the piece is it makes it seem as if 700,000 Palestinians spontaneously "fled or were expelled" from Israel. In fact, militants in the territory attacked Israel.
If those refugees had been granted citizenship, permanent housing and jobs in the places to which they fled, we wouldn't be having this conversation. That's not to excuse the forfeiture. We can talk reparations for everyone who lost property during that time -- including the 800k Jews who unwillingly forfeited property in the Arab states. It's just to say you don't hear Arab Jews talk much about their own refugee status because they WERE housed, fed and employed.
JVP does not represent mainstream Jewish thought. You should read a wider variety of opinions and experiences. 99% of the countries on this planet are analogous to ethnostates. With the exception of America, perhaps, all expect their immigrants to assimilate. France's secularism is a perfect example, but the entire EU is regretting their huge influx of Muslims because they are changing the national "character" of those countries. I think you're just confused because Judaism is part of Israel's national character.
Ongoing West Bank settlements are bad. Anyone who claims land was given to them alone by God is delusional, which includes Hamas. Handing the government to the fundamentalist fringe is never a good idea -- Gaza and Israel are both cases in point.
Remember when the left was against war and big pharma? I member! Every free press reader should take a pledge not to vote for the party that backs these psychopaths.
You should head over to San Francisco next week for some before and after photos. They finally got rid of homeless encampments to save face in front of CCP dictator Xi Jinping and his Commiefornia court eunuch Gavin.
My God, it’s starting to feel like you’re better off hiring high school students than your college grads. We’re in a lot of trouble once these people decide that they want positions of power and start running for office.
Nah - just remember - even in New York and California, 40% of the votes went to the (R) party. It's the morons that always provide the electoral differences.
There’s a reason why responsible businesses used to have dress codes and didn’t give people with chartreuse hair the time of day as either customers or employees.
“global intifada”—by which he meant the overthrow of capitalism—“is a desire shared by all working people across the world.”
The only people I've ever heard calling for the overthrow of Capitalism are tatted, over pierced, purple haired baristas and burger flippers; you know, those young people who think the world owes them a living and want everyone else to pay for it.
What was smart of the interviewer here was to never interject on who was speaking to logically rebut him or her. He didn't have to. Their answers stood out in sharp contrast to anything remotely comprehensible.
I couldn't get through even 45 seconds of that without feeling nauseous. The first five words say all you need to hear, "Peace is not the answer." That this comes from the mouths of a group called "Peace and Freedom Party" is an irony only Orwell could truly appreciate.
At the risk of being labeled a tinfoil hat conspiracy theorist, I can't help but wonder how this intensely savage anti-Semitic movement (for lack of a better word) came together in such a quick amount of time. The first of their now endless hatefest rallies began less than 24 hours after the Hamas assault. FFS, the bodies of the slaughtered innocents were not even cold yet before "River to the Sea" echoed from bullhorns across the country -- and the world.
You can't tell me that this was purely organic, "grass roots" organizing. I'm more than willing to accept that the FBI or even the CIA has a hand in this. Consider for a moment the shift in public dialog. Just like that, nobody is talking about Ukraine, the impending implosion of the economy (Moody's just downgraded the U.S. again yesterday), transphobia, climate "crisis" any more. Death to Israel is the new "Latest Thing". Because the carbon footprint of massive and endless war doesn't count.
I also agree it's a conspiracy, but that China is behind it. Their psy-op campaign, which has divided our nation, has to be the most successful in history.
As the Free Press has pointed out repeatedly, the ignorance of history and even of current events expressed by these “protesters” is due to the total capture of our education system, from kindergarten through University. Unless we reform the educational system, we will continue down this path. Withholding donations to Universities is a start but much more needs to be done.
I read yesterday that the difference between our politicians and the Israeli's, is that their children are in the IDF. Skin in the game always brings clarity of purpose.
The most pathetic of all the pathetic individuals in this video is the woman who rambles on about DACA when asked what decolonization would look like here. Here, decolonization would look like Native Americans storming into her home and scalping her and her family. If she isn't OK with that, she shouldn't be OK with it happening to Israelis.
I know I shouldn’t be shocked, but I always am. These people are so unbelievably ill informed. They know nothing about nothing, yet they’re out there marching in the streets. These useful idiots put us all in danger. The young lady on the stage talking about growing mangoes obviously has no idea that Israel left countless greenhouses in Gaza when they withdrew in 2005. Hamas burned down every single one of them. She has no idea that Palestine is run by kleptocrats who line their pockets by stealing aid money. Ugh.
I believe that the notion that these "kids" are going through their adolescent idealistic crazies and will grow out of it is wishful thinking. They have been radicalized in their cultish zeal and have actively invested too much of themselves in their delusions to acknowledge the naiveté of their imagined enlightenment. The theme of antisemitism is the current rallying focus serving to reenforce their sense of meaning, purpose and identity as crusaders, but when that loses its momentum and no longer provides the self-elevating shot-in-the-arm that it does today, there will be the next straw enemy to provide "purpose". If they continue to be treated like youths needing patient tolerance, they will likely get more organized and possibly even more radical. I'm afraid that the US is entering a long struggle with its own home grown expression of the ISIS phenomenon.
Jew were living in that part of the world before Islam even existed. Who are the real colonizers??
BTW-- The Christians are calling, they want Constantinople back.
👏from the ocean to the lake👏
👏Islamophobia is fake👏
It’s not a phobia if it’s something you are *supposed to* be afraid of.
And western society has allowed the "religion of peace" to immigrate/infiltrate their countries without restraint....
I don't fear Islam, only those who commit atrocities in the name of it.
I fear islam. It's a violent religion.
It is a religion of hate.
I do not fear any religion. I fear only those who commit atrocities in the name of their god. To breed violence and hatred is nothing unique to Islam...
True, any religion (or belief system really, other than perhaps Buddhism) can be twisted and used as a pretext for violence and even war. Islam is predicated on the very idea. Death to the infidels and claim their lands for Allah!
Even the most radical fundamentalist of Christians don't detonate bomb vests in a restaurant full of women and children, cut babies out of the womb and decapitate them, or violate and torture women in the most barbaric fashions imaginable.
And while the Catholics and the Mormons display a particular disgust for gays, and have worked even in conjunction to deny them civil rights, they have yet to tie them to chairs and throw them off of buildings.
It's not a question of degrees, it's a question of humanity. The concept is anathema to Islam -- whose very name means submission. Yours.
Sorry but most Christians accept homosexual people they are just unable to affirm something the Bible clearly indicated as a departure from Gods intent. Many Christians, well all, fall short, but we do not demand affirmation of our shortfall. Judgement belongs to God. In the interim ,we are to love our neighbors as ourselves and homosexual neighbors are included.
If you're homosexual in Israel or America you get a parade. If you're homosexual in Gaza you get killed. Enough said.
That's part of the Jewish Covenant, not yours. Where you find what you might twist in the New Testament it turns out to be interpolation derived from Leviticus. It isn't even ment in a moral sense from what I gather from Rabbis. You can't claim a god of love and be against love; you are just asking to be laughed at.
Even the Buddhists. Example A: Myanmar.
Well that's depressing to know. So essentially all religion is manipulative dogma. Marx was right one about thing at least.
Yup, in the right circumstances, even Buddhists can be violent.
I believe the Buddhist angle is a new one in the past year in Myanmar. The coup leaders have attempted to recruit support from the monks, to add legitimacy to what they are doing, which is mass murder of mostly everyone they dont like. Pretty similar to Hamas and the Israelis, as well as numerous religious sects around the world.
What stops or slows the violence, is good people, with moral conviction to stand up to the atrocities that are committed. When they are committed, appropriate action is needed to send a message back to killers, such as what the IDF is doing to Hamas. Yes, some civilians are caught in the crossfire, but certainly the IDF is taking great pains, and personal risks, to try and protect civilian populations.
In the old days of school yard fights, the question was asked of all present, "who started it"?. you usually dont get the truth, unless all parties are in the same room, and history is laid bare.
rich
What religion are the Rohingya, hmm? Burma is complicated; but in the case of the Rohingya they started it with the usual Islamic shite.
Maybe they are pseudo Buddhists
When people talk about the violence of Christianity they’re talking a time when life everywhere was hard and people were barbaric. Every religion grew up, modernized, etc. Every religion except for Islam.
Yes, this was my point.
The history of christianity is even bloodier than what ISIS did. They burned tens of thousand of innocent people alive. There is no brutality that hasn't been committed at some point in the name of the christian god and don't forget the worst crime in human history, the holocaust, was committed by a Christian country.
Nowadays christianity seems somewhat tamed, but only because secularism broke its power. Under the surface the ugly side of religion is still alive in christianity too and is waiting to be unleashed again. It doesn't take much as we can see in the history of jewish people in Europe.
That of course doesn't excuse the horrific acts committed by islamists in our times. But we should never pretend our culture is somewhat better and superior because it's rooted in Christianity instead of islam. It's not. It's just different strains from the same source and in some centuries Christianity has been more bloody and in others islam.
You make several very cogent points, and indeed many crimes and horrid acts have been committed in the name of a Christian God. But you are making an enormous oversight in what I would label your false equivalency argument in that no where in the New Testament is violence advocated...and the primary precept of all Christianity is the command to love God and love one's neighbor as oneself. Whereas, the Quran explicitly condones and advocates both violence towards and treating "non-believers" as second class citizens.
Man is man. He is capable of terrible acts. But a religion can guide him to it, train him for it, promise him rewards for it, justify it.
(did anyone hear the phone call from the Hamas terrorist while he was killing in Israel, calling his mom and dad for praise with about a dozen Allahu Akbars in between. That was chilling.)
for one, I'm agnostic, have not special allegiance to any religion. But comparing what Islamists do today, to what Christians did 1000 years ago, is sort of the point. If you and I were talking in the year 1095, sure, we can condemn the crusades and similar, and say "this should stop immediately", but we aren't living then. What happened then is no justification for now, and any rational person should be able to look at it and say "this is wrong, and maybe it's driven by a religion that is still 1000 years out of sync with the rest of civilization". Maybe the Christian church had some blame in 1095, and maybe Islam has some blame (and responsibility) today. That is not illogical.
Yes. The church officials that burned heretics at the stake were the actual heretics.
Can you tell which ones those are?
Usually not until it's too late.
There ya go.
FYI the Quran (which contains the precepts, rules and instruction of Islam) actually endorses quite a lot of atrocities very specifically. So if I understand you correctly you fear Hamas and all the other Islamic terrorist organizations who commit atrocities in the name of Islam, but are okay with teaching that atrocities are "okay" just as long as you don't act on them?
What about those who turn a blind eye, or excuse, or donate to causes that then use that to fund those who commit atrocities in the name of Islam? They are united by a religion the supporters and the terrorists, and seem to start with a bias of support if something is done in the name of that religion.
True. I could peacefully engage with Sufis
I thought if I disagreed with them I was showing _____phobia. Fill in the blanks with whatever fits the topic of disagreement.
I have phobiaphobia. Covers all the bases.
Lucy: Or maybe you have pantophobia. Do you think you have pantophobia?
Charlie Brown: What's pantophobia?
Lucy: The fear of everything!
Charlie Brown: THAT’S IT!
edit: Therapy session. https://youtu.be/dudc4rypH-Q
Could be!
But maybe that's really fear of pants?
I am not afraid of pants.
😂
Islamoronic.
Islamofatuous.
Islamoidic.
Islamoidiot.
A phobia is something to be afraid of. What to you call something you despise?
A phobia is an irrational fear, Bruce.
And fear of Islamists is a rational fear.
No, dear Celia, fear of Islamists is irrational. The are lunatics and fiends but we should not fear them. Hatred of them, on the other hand, is perfectly rational.
I also hate them.
But I don't think it's irrational to fear them. These are people who believe that it's *good* to rape, torture, mutilate, and murder. They are criminals of the worst sort. It is legitimately frightening to know that these people walk the earth, and that there are people here, in my own country, who support them.
😂😂excellent Kevin!
You have said in sentence what it took me a whole paragraph to say a couple of days ago.
You forget, according to the masses of uneducated people with privilege and those in countries with state controlled media facts don't matter and they think history beyond 75 years is irrelevant in the land Jews inhabited for over 3,000 years except when they were forcibly thrown out so who's land is it really........uh oh......logic (which will be ignored)
They don't really think history beyond 75 years is irrelevant; they just want to hide the relevance from the public.
They don't know history of any length. That one moron who said the Palestinians were "Genocided" on October 7 deserves a special tall hat and a place in the corner of the special needs classroom for the end of eternity.
"You forget, according to the masses of uneducated people with privilege and those in countries with state controlled media facts don't matter and they think history beyond 75 years is irrelevant."
- Irrelevant? Well that depends on which issue/group you're talking about. ;)
So you’re hitting George Soros up for some overtime by working on the weekend?
Lol. Nah. Just multi-tasking during the MI-Penn State game.
Get some new material. The "Soros" stuff is old, dude.
Sorry, there is never an expiration date on evil. Soros qualifies.
Evil is in the eye of the beholder. For example, from the Hamas or Iranian Mullahs' perspective, Oct 7th was anything but!
Are you rooting for Michigan because of Dearborn being full of people who hate America?
Oh wait, are you rooting for Penn because of the time Fetterman chased a black guy down the street with a shotgun in Pennsylvania?
He took Penn State without the points.
I worked in Dearborn from 1980-90. I enjoyed the culture, and the restaurants. I have no idea when it became radicalized. It was mostly 2nd/3rd generation citizens who were proud to be citizens of the US back then.
Who are the people in Dearborn that hate America?
Fetterman chased a black guy?.....well he was probably an election poll worker who was stealing votes from Trump, wasn't he, KevinDurant? ;)
Lol.....you want to keep going?
No - you two NEVER get old! You guys are like F Troop reruns. I am still trying to figure out which one of you is Cpl. Agarn and who is the Chief of the Hickawi. 😂
To anyone on the left, history stops as soon as some mythical oppressed group they can use to advance vile power dynamics went from the oppressor to the oppressed.
To anyone on the right, history begins post 1965 and the only people who have ever been legitimately oppressed are white, heterosexual males. Rhetoric that's used to get people to vote against their own economic interest by ginning up hatred of "the Other," domestically and internationally, in order to maintain their vile power dynamics.
1619? lol
The latest race hustle.
Well, Bruce, that doesn't adequately rebut anything I said....but ok.
Yes, Bruce, black people were here in 1619.
I can understand your anger.
No, to people on the right they look back into history dispassionately 1,000’s of years.
As always, you simply lie.
The left is ONLY interested in advancing their power to oppress those they disagree with.
Yes. That explains all the "Confederate pride." Very dispassionate.
Advancing power to oppress those they disagree with? You mean like making it illegal to use roads/highways to leave the state to get an abortion? Or passing laws making it illegal to not do business with Israel? Or gerrymandering districts to deny black voters in AL? Or banning books that discuss race, gender, sexual orientation?
What on EARTH are you even talking about? History begins as far back as you care to go, all kinds of people have been oppressed, but today it is undeniable by people who do not lie to themselves that there is an anti-White straight male vibe emanating from Woke politics. Vote against our own economic interest by doing what??? Where do you GET this stuff?
What am I talking about? Things were fixed in 1965. That's "old shit" - what are you complaining about?.....but yes, lest talk about Muslim conquests in the 6th century
Hope folks are enjoying not having the ACA.....I mean "Nigger - - "..... I mean "Obama Care."
that's ridiculous, inaccurate, and hyperbolic.
"That" is actually the GOP "Southern Strategy."
Demonization of "the Other" - Which has been repeatedly run since then, with various groups inserted.
Hope people enjoy not having ACA, I mean "Nigge- " I mean, "ObamaCare"
They want all history to be irrelevant if it doesn’t fit their narrative. They can disregard or flip something that happened yesterday if it doesn’t further the agenda.
Indeed, Jews are the indigenous peoples. Think of Israel as an Indian reservation in the aftermath of an endless "Trail of Tears". The Arabs are the colonizers who have conquered many nations. They possess vast resources and wealth, but are seething with rage that this little patch of land, the sole sanctuary for a tiny and long-oppressed tribe, is beyond their grasp.
No. They're seething with rage because jews are underpeople without rights in their religion. And that land was conquered for Mohammed in a dream. It is an outrage to see people Mohammed declared fit for death or servitude living free and doing BETTER!
This is what makes them enraged. It's the same kind of fury someone truly believing in KKK ideology feels seeing rich black people who are doing better. Even more rage inducing if those rich black people give them charity---which is demeaning.
Backward 7th century tribal barbarians jealous of 21st century civilized people doing well? How dare you speak the truth??
Their Jim Jones type psychopath told them to kill everyone who doesn't convert or pay them to stay alive while they stand on their necks. Told them rape is good. Told them torture is good. Told them taking slaves is good. Told them it's a religious obligation to lie and to decieve with every stratagem of war. Told them to treat any who claim to be one of them that doesn't fight as worse than their enemy. Told them they are going to a whoreouse in the sky forever if they obey him.
I would agree slot of the hatred of Israel is their success. Palestine is a mess and Israel is a thriving economy. The left only likes struggling minorities. Asians in the US are the same. Their children achieve in school and warrant access to magnet schools and the best universities but are crowded out by affirmative action placements. It’s as the story identifies at the root is a toxic victim culture. The victim narrative is only possible if you paint Palestine as occupied, despite the fact that they are not. Or that Israel is a colonizer, even though they are on land that has been theirs since the the before the 6th century BC. We should discuss those colonizing Babylonians who took over Israel in the 5th century BC. Probably not. That’s way more than 75 years ago.
In a nutshell David!
And we want Smyrna back too. If you haven't seen the movie Smyrna, that came out this year, it's another genocidal attack on Greeks and Armenians by the usual suspects.
The book Paradise Lost gives a chilling description of Ataturk ravaging of Smyrna.
The movie, Smyrna, made by really talented Greek filmmakers based on a diary, depicts life in Smyrna before, leading up to, and during the massacre. It's in Greek, French--the lingua Franca in the marketplace, English in diplomatic communications, and a bit of Turkish. As a Greek-American, I just cried. Obviously, we all know the end and I don't want to "spoil" it, but let's say, the modus operandi of the attack is familiar.
"The Christians are calling, they want Constantinople back"
LOL!!!!
"IDF soldiers pray in ancient 6th century Gaza synagogue for first time in decades "
https://www.jpost.com/judaism/article-772218
But wait, how is there is a 6th century Jewish synagogue in Gaza 🥸? My tenured college professor who cannot be fired and my social media feeds taught me all that land was Palestine and the Jews colonized it in 1948.............🧐 #therealturth #standwithIsrael #HamasIsISIS #stopbeingmanipulated #HamasIsTheRealOppressor #learnthetruth
I know, right. History being taught today in colleges and elsewhere is like me, who doesn't know crap about hockey, speculating on the Canucks future......
You should start posting that article to friends' feed.
"speculating on the Canucks future......"
They will mostly suck, with occasional fits of mediocrity.
100% how dare those colonizers pray in a synagogue from the 6th century ... didn't someone tell them they only got there in 1948?
How would it have survived in Gaza after Israeli withdrawal in 2005?
I still don't understand the use of the word "colonizer" in this example. To colonize, don't you need a nation to begin with, and then conquer others and make them a colony that pays you taxes?
How is Israel a colonizer?
These activists see white Jews and think all Jews are white. Only whites can be colonizers in their world and dark-skin people colonized. Yes, it's that crude and ignorant an equation and it's rampant in institutions and corporations.
I've never stopped calling it Constantinople.
NCM, very good historical perspective. Utopia is non-existent, but what an excuse for destruction of the West.
"Who are the real colonizers?"--that is the essential point--"Israel "stole" the land!" goes the cry from the religion that stole lands from the Infidel--the non-Muslims-- for over a millenium--yes, that's right, all you Westerners who were never taught the history of Islamic conquests or the treatment of the defeated Infidels: exile, conversion or death--and that choice was only afforded those who survived the atrocities, which in many cases exceeded in brutality even those of Oct. 7th. See, for example the Siege of Constantinople on Wikipedia, and scrolldown to atrocities section. See? Nothing has changed in 6 centuries; it is still the very same Islam.
"Colonizers must go!"
sayeth the followers of a religion that conquered Spain, North Africa, Egypt, the Levant, the Caucuses, several Mediterranean islands and later Anatolia, Nubia and southeastern Europe from the Christians. From the Zoroastrians they conquered Persia and parts of Central Asia. From the Buddhists they conquered Afghanistan, other parts of Central Asia and Bangladesh. From the Hindus they eventually conquered most of the Indian Subcontinent.
In all of these cases, religious groups such as Christians and Jews, and later Zoroastrians, Hindus, Buddhists and other religions were given the status of "dhimmi" meaning they were officially protected by the Muslim government, but had to pay a special "jizya" tax and were not given the same rights as Muslims.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Muslim_conquests#/media/File:The_Early_Muslim_Conquests_630s_to_820s.svg
I was unaware that any people were considered to be people of the book and afforded second class status other than Christians and Jews. And Jews in Spain were treated abysmally.
"Colonizers must go" supporters don't want to know history; they want to utilize their latest argument to destroy Israel and the US--the two Western powers,
coincidentally, in Iran's sights.
Interesting it has taken $13 billion in Middle Eastern funds to 200 colleges and universities to re-educate American youth to think like Middle Eastern Islamists. Obama would have liked the idea of running America from the perspective of his father, who lived in a colonized nation (although not colonized by America--it didn't matter--the idea was that America was powerful and this was bad.
That idea undergirds the decolonization movement in the US today. It is so antithetical to self preservation and logic as to be literally mind-boggling. You can teach apparently anyone, anything, with a combination of propaganda and censorship.
These people interviewed were um…not intelligent. At. All. Trying stay nice here.
The breadth and depth of the delusions were astonishing.
Can we give the Americas back to the Indigenous people? They did a better job anyway.
Yeah, fighting and enslaving each other. But go ahead and romanticize the virtuous indigenous peoples. Anyone is better than someone from Western Civilization, right?
Don’t forget child sacrifice. At least we limit it to the unborn.
who are not yet children, Mike.
Yes. Just human beings who are not yet born.
My (sarcastic) point exactly. 🤪
Oh sorry Lee Bee. My misunderstanding
👍
I got it! However many, many people don't understand sarcastic humor. Which is kind of odd given the popularity of TGIF.
It can be difficult, without some sort of clue or broad-based comment to recognize written sarcasm. When spoken, tone of voice is indicative of sarcasm.
Hence “Poe’s Law”.
Yeah, them Comanches were a ton of fun.
Apparently being somewhere first is very important to the virtue signallers--unless they are talking about Muslims, who have a doible secret exemption.
I'm waiting for someone to educate me. Which nations today are still inhabited and ruled by their original indigenous peoples?
Jews make the point that they can trace their ancestry to the Hebrews who settled in the area around 1000 BC. Of course powerful neighbors waged wars on them, and they were exiled, but they kept coming back.
Then Islam burst out of Arabia and started conquering and subjugating everyone around them. Such a nice religion of peace. Once a land is claimed by Islam, its past is wiped away. Jews disagree. Palestinians don’t acknowledge this. They say history started in 1948. Very convenient narrative.
From 1948 until the 6 day war (1967) Egypt occupied Gaza with the exception of a year in 1957 right after the Suez Crisis (where Egypt blocked the Suez Canal in an attempt to destroy Israel) It was after the Suez Crisis that US/French/British governments stepped up to seriously arm/defend Israel to protect the Suez Canal. So the claim of Israel occupation can't start until 1967..........so roughly a 38 year occupation in which there was multiple wars and constant terrorism against Israel by various Muslim countries/organizations.
The French, I think.
Especially the fullness of their written language--oh that's right, they didn't have one. The Western World brought civilization, culture and education to both the indigenous in the Americas and the Indians in India. The key to happiness is gratefulness.
Well they did give us tobacco.
A long, slow death...revenge.
Their casinos are great revenge too.
And also their unregulated cannabis products.
What’s this?
Corn.
Now we can make torillas!
We’ve been waiting for this for hundreds of years!
I’ve just invented tacos!
….
Corn?
Now we can make whiskey !
We’ve been waiting for this for hundreds of years!
I just invented the Tom Collins!
I read a fascinating article in the NYT Sunday Magazine (MANY YEARS AGO) about cultures around the world that live above a specific altitude above sea level that actively spurn written language, basically because it can so easily be warped and weaponized. Wish I could find it, but I bet it was 20 or 25 years ago.
Keep looking.
As opposed to sign language, which could not be???
They probably did a much better job learning to respect nature and family elders, healing practices, and more - -but they were also very busy killing each others tribes in extraordinary ways. The Comanches in the US were feared because of their ruthless brutality and extreme violence, (and not above kidnapping babies). Because they did not overcome the Europeans, these practices are rarely discussed or highlighted - only their virtuous attributes. They could be as ruthless and brutal as the worst of the Europeans. Tends to get overlooked (although I grew up witnessing how badly many were treated in modern N America, that’s true, too).
Again, I once read that Custer’s men’s bodies were mutilated and that Custer himself was hideously and gruesomely (especially to guys) desecrated.
Yes, just look up Comanche torture.
and not above kidnapping babies
IIRC, when the Comanches raided other tribes or settlers, the babies and men were killed. Women and teens were taken as slaves....sometimes, others they were all killed.
Yes and sometimes the babies were snatched, too.
At least the native Americans (formerly knnown as Indians) appear to have been the original indigenous people. The Palestinians were not; the Muslims were not; indeed, they did not exist before the 7th Century, and were preceded by people of other religions who were overrun by invading Islamic armies.
Sure...
Yeah right! As the little girl in the video said, let’s vacate the country, it might be hard ….maybe we can all settle in Mexico (I’m sure they wouldn’t mind, probably because they have had no past experience with colonialism 😳)
European/Ashkenazi Jews. That's who the real colonizers were/are.
Why is Comprof so delusional? Does he have a problem with Pakistan too if he's offended by countries under a century old carved from new borders in an everchanging political and national landscape?
Nooo. Comprof has a problem only with certain groups because Comprof is an avowed racist and antisemite.
Don’t engage with the troll N&C!
GAAHHHHH!!! Too la- never mind…
I usually ignore the troll but I'm in a mood today. Had enough of his bs
Direct the mood or anger elsewhere N&C, that troll ain’t worth the energy you going to waste.
Lol. I have never said anything anti-Semitic or racist -and you cannot provide any evidence of such.
Btw, which "Semites" are you talking about? ;)
I am anti-occupation and intentional bombing of civilians. Which is not inherently anti-Jew....unless you think that is part of their nature, "Nuance & Context." :)
You can't answer my points because they're FACTS. So keep deflecting,. How many Muslim deaths have you protested in Yemen, in Syria:, in Iran? How many other wars raging right now do you open your big mouth about? None. Because you only look for attention when it's Jews and Israel. Tell me again how you're not a bigot?
You're all over the comments with your gimmicky bs. But it's clear you don't read, you don't research. You're lazy. Cmon, man. You clearly have the time. Take a break from the Jew baiting and divisive racist rhetoric for a second and LEARN something. What kind of a professor is anti-intellectial and a stranger to scholarly examination?
Unless you can present a coherent response here, you are simply embarrassing yourself.
So Comprof is busy crop-dusting the thread? Please don't feed the troll.
"What kind of a professor is anti-intellectial and a stranger to scholarly examination?"
Seriously? Those who teach Middle East history.
Haha! So true.
Answered your points perfectly. Let me do it again:
1. You have provided no points. So, there is nothing to respond to.
2. Have never said anything racist/antiSemitic.
3. I open my mouth about many wars, issues, etc. - THIS one just happens to be the most popular right now. Spoke often about Ukraine. Why haven't you opened you big mouth about Myanmar?
4. Oh, so only speaking about the biggest current world event right now, and not say....Myanmar.
5, Everything I have said is 100% accurate. Which is why you cannot debunk any of it and have no recourse but to hurl ad hominem attacks and accuse people of being anti-Semitic. That is getting old. People aren't falling for it anymore.
Yes! You've convinced me Compost! You are the smartest and most well-read poster here! I fully agree with all of your points; in fact your utilization of the English language is second to none. I would say you "owned" the crowd with this last post!
Denying the real history for only the Jews might be considered just a weeee bit Antisemitic as is claiming Israel is intentionally bombing civilians.... When Hamas puts a rocket launcher in a school or hospital they must be destroyed and if you look you will see evacuation warnings are given by Israel but Hamas shoots Gazans who try to flee. Judaism predates Islam, the Jews inhabited the land over 3,000 years ago so who is occupying what exactly?
Well said. I'm not sure if you know, but Comprof has a reputation here for engaging people purely to get under their skin and using illogical round -about arguments to prolong painful pointless debate. I usually ignore him but I've had enough today of all the lies about Israel.
We all have known someone like Comprof in real life. They’re the little boys who chase girls around the schoolyard with snakes because that’s the only way they know to be the center of attention. Most grow out of it, but others, like our resident troll, are still so insecure and resentful that they actively seek out people to bait. Feel sorry for for Childprof, but don’t take his bait. It’s like wrestling with a pig: you get muddy and the pig likes it. I save my irritability for the guys trying to sell me a car warranty.
But isn't everything a weeeee bit "anti-Semitic" these days, BeCivil1?
I wonder if Hamas were able to hide material, supplies, tunnels under Israeli schools, hospitals, etc.....would that same standard apply?
As far as intentionally bombing....send an email to this dude.
https://www.reddit.com/r/IsraelCrimes/comments/17rqmj8/israel_bombed_the_courtyard_of_the_shifa/
Yes. People were told to evacuate to the southern Gaza....which is also getting bombed.
Hamas shoots Gazans who try to flee? What evidence do you have of that? Says who? Israel?.....certainly couldn't be the Gazans, because they are liars.
Which fairly tale came first is irrelevant. Non-Jews and Jews both inhabited the land.
Nope -- everything isn't a weeee bit Antisemitic, just you (and sadly many others). We all know you will keep going with the nonsense, lies, misinformation, and misdirection. Time for more football.
Non-Jews--Muslims, stole the land during the period of the Islamic conquests. They had to have stolen it from the Infidel, because Islam did not exist there prior to the 7th century.
The Jews of Israel are not "occupiers" or "colonizers." They won the land in a defensive war, after they were attacked, and later agreed to Bill Clinton's terms of total withdrawal for recognition of its existence. Arafat reneged at the last minute and started an intifada. Hmm... The Israelis also fell for the BS "land for peace" deal involving Gaza, where they left the land unilaterally__24 hours later Hamas was firing rockets across the border. What's the saying? Fool me twice, go fuck yourself?
Theodore Herzl and his fellow Zionist disagree with you. Take it up with them.
Now, until people in the West Bank and Gaza allowed to do what the want without, trade freely, repair homes, etc. without having to get permission from Israel, it is what it is.
Don't think you want to go down the "broken ceasefire" road :)
"The Nakba, which means “catastrophe” in Arabic, refers to the mass displacement and dispossession of Palestinians during the 1948 Arab-Israeli war. Before the Nakba, Palestine was a multi-ethnic and multi-cultural society. However, the conflict between Arabs and Jews intensified in the 1930s with the increase of Jewish immigration, driven by persecution in Europe, and with the Zionist movement aiming to establish a Jewish state in Palestine.
In November 1947, the UN General Assembly passed a resolution partitioning Palestine into two states, one Jewish and one Arab, with Jerusalem under a UN administration. The Arab world rejected the plan, arguing that it was unfair and violated the UN Charter. Jewish militias launched attacks against Palestinian villages, forcing thousands to flee. The situation escalated into a full-blown war in 1948."
They can keep trying this forever
Can wipe out every single Gazan, man, woman and child....which actually might be for the best.
Either way. I don't care. But the facts are what the facts are.
Theodore Herzl wasn't around for this, you moron. Yes, the facts are what the facts are.
So way to go totally ignoring the inconvenient facts I stated!
"Theodore Herzl and his fellow Zionist disagree with you. Take it up with them." No, you explain how they disagree.
As for your following paragraph,"until people in the West Bank and Gaza allowed to do what the want without, trade freely, repair homes, etc. without having to get permission from Israel, it is what it is." To do what they want is to import weapons for the purpose of destroying Israel--not my opinion--their Charters, statements, newspapers, speeches, etc. As for the rest, they have repurposed many items designated for improving living conditions to use as weapons or tunnel building. So give it a rest until you have something meaningful to argue, huh?
Define "occupation" please. Does the land not first have to belong to some group other than the occupiers'? To which group do you refer and how do you support the ownership claim post WWI? And if you are going to use the "people's ancestors have lived there for centuries" even if "we lost the land to the Allies in the war" argument, how do you account for the Muslims making that argument when for well over a thousand years, their conquering armies insisted on death, conversion or exile, not giving even lipservice to the "rights" of the Infidels (non-Muslims) whose families had lived thre for hundreds of years?
When you are not allowed to live/move freely with out the approval of another countries military, you are an occupied people.
When that military can enter you community and place their soldiers in your house as their own personal residence, you are an occupied people.
When another nations military provides back-up to their citizens as they kill you, steal farmland, homes and attack villages with impunity, you are an occupied people.
When you are given numbered ID tags to wear around your ankle, or you have to pass military checkpoints, in order to work, you are an occupied people.
When your airspace and maritime space are not yours, you are an occupied people.
When you are not allowed to trade freely, repair homes/buildings, have access to clean drinking water, etc. unless another nation's military allows it, you are an occupied people.
Israelis can vote for what happens to the Palestinians. Palestinians cannot vote for what happens to Israelis.
So, there is an occupation. The only is issue is what you choose to use are using to justify it. (WW2, ancestors, etc.) J
Just because prison guards don't live in the cells with the prisoners, doesn't mean those prisoners aren't incarcerated.
Muslim cultures/communities don't pretend to be democracies. Israel does. So, Israel can either (1) continue to try and keep this up in perpetuity or (2) kill all of the Palestinians.
It appears that they've finally got a free runway to do what I'm sure they've wanted to do for a long time and are going with #2.
Fine. Have at it. Let's just get it over with, so they can start paying for their own national defense.
Comprof2.0, I agree we should absolutely deal in only facts that are supported by evidence, so let's do that.
1. It is ahistorical to apply recent meaning to terms used more loosely in the past. Herzl's use of "colony" and "colonial" should not be confused with how those terms are used today. He was, in fact, emphatic that Jews not "infiltrate" Palestine. Rather, "Should the Powers (international community) declare themselves willing to admit our sovereignty over a neutral piece of land, then the Society will enter into negotiations for the possession of this land." This explains why so few Jews emigrated prior to statehood; Herzl was explicitly anti-colonial in the sense it is used today.
2. As there was no U.N. at the time, Herzl lobbied Britain, Germany, Italy/the Pope, and the Sultan of Turkey repeatedly. It was clear the Ottoman Empire was ending and the Middle East was going to be apportioned. The Middle East was indeed primarily Arab when Israel was established. And you have correctly pointed out that resident Arabs were not consulted about its formation. However, they were not consulted about any apportionment decisions, so I'm not sure why that's relevant. The international community created Israel as both a form of reparations for the Holocaust and as a way to get rid of their own refugee Jewish populations. Was it theirs to grant? Arguably not. But the pre-Nakba land was in fact purchased and Israel isn't going away, so let's move on.
3. Your biggest historical error is to claim Israelites started the War for Independence. This is patently untrue. Inhabitants of the rejected Palestinian state attacked first, only to be joined by the other Arab nations.
4. The Arabs living on that land both fled and were expelled. Just as I believe the creation of Israel would have been very unlikely if Jews were successfully assimilated in the Diaspora, I believe the Palestinian national consciousness would not exist had they been granted citizenship in the places to which they fled, had they been housed, fed and clothed. Are these Arabs also worthy of reparations? Yes! By whom? Now we can start the debate. That debate must include the property loss experienced by the 800,000 Arab Jews who fled and were expelled from Iran, Syria, Lebannon, etc. and whether the two-state solution is reparations enough.
5. You, like so many, seem unable to move forward because you cannot accept facts without what-about-ism. Hamas seeks the destruction of Israel, the death of all Jews, and the conquering of all non-Islamic peoples. They are imperialist and genocidal. Period. Does it matter that they have written it down and indoctrinate their youth? Absolutely. Poll after poll attests to the widespread acceptance of their ideology within Gaza and the West Bank. We must assume Palestinians have agency like any other people. Do we excuse non-abolitionists as being merely products of their environment?
6. Ultra-Orthodox Jews are supremacist and nationalist. According to them, there is no place in Israel where Arabs are welcome. Bad, but if we're being honest, not quite as bad. A quick survey of the literature attests that most Israeli children are taught a more nuanced and even-handed picture of mid-east conflict. The ultra-orthodox are not required to participate in civil society and so are far more indoctrinated. I hold them equally accountable for their abhorrent views and behavior. Israel must root out its fundamentalist elements. I am hopeful things are headed that way -- because Israel is a democracy.
7. Finally, intent matters. If you think there is no difference between manslaughter and murder, I cannot help you. And if your ethical viewpoint is purely utilitarian, where only numbers matter, the debate ends here. I am an unapologetic deontologist. I believe in universally applied principles.
Lol. "rAciST!"
In fact, it is not.
1. Were the majority of Zionist who est. the state of Israel Ashkenazi Jews from Europe? Yes or No?
2. Did Theodore Herzl, et. al communicate/work with the British in what he described as a Zionist "colonial project" in regards to establishing the state of Israel? Yes or No?
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But before them, it was the Arab colonizers and before them the Roman colonizers and before them it was the Persian colonizers of Israel's lands.
Now, now, Jeff, don't confuse the virtue-signallers.
Can you name Israel’s colonies?
I can direct you to Theodore Herzl's communication with the British where he defined/described the creation of Israel as a colonial project/endeavor. So, take it up with him and rest of his crew.
Maybe they should just stop occupying Gaza and the West Bank first, then they can take on bigger tasks.
No need to direct me anywhere - your comment provides the answer. Tell me how is Israel occupying Gaza if it withdrew from there in 2005? Hmmm. Seems like Hamas is the occupier since they do nothing but damage to their own people. As for West Bank - hmmm - tell me why it’s an occupation again?
Don't waste your breath on Comprof.
Why didn't I listen to you???? If Comprof2.0 isn't a bot s/he truly has an incredible gift for being completely immune to reason. Take this statement, which seems to make sense at first but then you realize how each phrase is a non-sequitur: "Muslim cultures/communities don't pretend to be democracies. Israel does. So, Israel can either (1) continue to try and keep this up in perpetuity or (2) kill all of the Palestinians." It's just so bizarre. How does a bot learn to be non-sensical AND hostile???
Aw, Theresa....why not?
Think you might run the risk of learning uncomfortable facts.
The PA can’t control Hamas. However to be fair Israel can’t control many of the settlers who victimize Muslims and Christians.
Uh huh. Right. Ok then /S.
Of course you don't want to be directed to the actual words of Herlz, et. al ;) Colonial project. Fact.
Can people in Gaza or the West Bank do anything without Israeli approval? Hmmm.
Are Palestinian workers, tagged around the ankle with ID numbers - hmmm.
Left the inside of the jail and went to the outside. That's all.
The best recruiter for Hamas is Israel.
You want to keep going?
maybe if they stopped shooting rockets at Israel, then Israel wouldn’t need to protect itself by a blockade and extra security on who it lets in as workers.
I mean, if every other neighbor you let into your house tried to attack you, wouldn’t you start taking precautions?
Funny you have no comment about Egypt, who also has a blockaded border with Gaza, and unlike Israel, wouldn’t give any work visas to Gazans so they might enjoy some measure of prosperity not provided by their own despotic government, run by fundamental islamists who after embezzling billions in aid money money meant for the people, live in luxury with other despots in Qatar and holiday in Turkey.
Oh my goodness, thanks for the chuckles - spoken like a parrot, all full of buzzwords with huge omissions! Laughable.
They having been "occupying" Gaza for 15 years. Try to keep up.
Until Gazans are able to live/move freely without having to get Israel's permission, they are "occupied." Try and keep up.
They're not colonizers6. They're refugees.
Oh, so refugees get to create their own country now?
Hmmm.....well, we need start rethinking some U.S. immigration policy, I guess.
Comprof- the 15 million people of Israel don't care what you think. They live in a country that has an uninterrupted Jewish presence that has been a sanctuary for Jewish refugees not just from Europe but North Africa and other Middle Eastern countries in 1948 and onwards. Over the decades it has been a sanctuary for Jews escaping the kind of danger, harassment amd discrimination you advocate for againstus. Israel can let in who they wish. Your genocidal views are not relevant ro a country that has turned desert and swampland into a thriving and productive oasis of human rights and innovation.
Why is it so hard for you to pick up a history book? And do you really have a job? You are all over the comments sections. Or maybe Hamas is paying you to be their mouthpiece. Great gig.
"the 15 million people of Israel don't care what you think."
- And I don't care what they think. Although they are NOT happy with Netanyahu, which is progress.
For the rest of your stuff.....blah....blah....blah....
How about Israel just stop occupying people and allowing dual-citizenship setters to murder Palestinians, take their land, burn their homes, etc. without consequence? Pathetic you think that is genocidal or means someone is working for Hamas. Sad.
Israel is an ethnocracy, not a democracy. A state where Jews are at the top of all societal structures while non-Jews (Arabs, Gentiles, etc.)
Yep. Do have a job. Pays very well. I don't work on the weekends.
Are you a complete ignoramus? Israel is the ONLY democracy in the Middle East and the only one where apartheid is NOT policy.. 21% of its population are arabs who have full rights and protections as every other citizen. They have more rights in fact, than arabs anywhere else in the middle east and all the parts of Africa arabs colonized. Facts.
Your other stupid accusations about Israel acting with impunity without consequence defy every piece of evidence on record. How about you sit down with a map and Google Arab pogroms, Yassir Arafat, the Partition Plan, the amount of times the Palestinians have been offered their own state, and do something useful on your day off.
Funny how the Muslim "ethnocracies", which kicked the Jews out before there was an Israel, don't seem to bother you. Or ever mention how these wonderful people treat women__ or gays, torturing them or throwing them off of rooftops. Or the fact that the Grand Mufti leader of the Palestinians implored his buddy Hitler to murder all the Jews who lived in the area. Or how you never mention the Hamas charter, which is a handbook for genocide. You're a woman. The only place you'll be treated as an equal in the Middle East is Israel. It's like gays supporting Hamas. A sad joke.
Tell that to the Israeli Arab Supreme Court Justice who sent a Jewish PM to jail... ugh the ignorance and stupidity...
have you been to California?
Yip - it’s a sh.thole!
Used to live there for quite a few years. California is a massive state.
It is not a Mexican state.
There are probably too many black/brown people for your liking, but it not a Mexican state. Your comment was dumb.
key words. "used to"
If refugees say from Mexico want to go back to Mexico and make it better, then they are more than welcome to!
What did they colonize and from which nation?
Talk to Theodore Herzl et al. who had many communications with the British to work with them in what he and his fellow Zionists referred to as the "colonial project" to establish the state of Israel.
Until the people in Gaza and West Bank are allowed to live/move freely without Israeli approval, it is what it is. - no matter how you spin it.
You're joking, right? You were always a sad stereotype, but at least I thought you were educated. My bad!
Where the majority of Zionist who founded Israel from Europe? Yes or No?
Did Theodore Herzl, etc. communicate/work with the British to establish what they referred to as a "colonial project?" Yes or No?
Yeah and the moon landing was faked.
Oh....so the majority of Zionist were NOT from Europe....is that what you're saying?
As far as your moon landing. That is as accurate as saying the land that currently comprises Israel was actually "theirs" pre-1948.
Indeed they were after 6 Million of them were slaughtered so they sought refuge in the land that has been the land of the Jews for over 3,000 years and at the time most of it was arid and uninhabited and at the time was a British colony after it was part of the Ottoman empire and other empires before that. You fool no one but yourself.
Actually land of Jews and non-Jews.
Wait.....how could it be the "land of the Jews" it was part of the Ottoman empire and other empires before that? :)....how could it have been a British colony from 1917-1948 if it was "the land of the Jews?" How could there have been "Palestinian Jews" pre-1948 if there was never something known as "Palestine?"
Make up your mind.
If you knew history AT ALL, you would know that it was the land of Jews from the time of Abraham. Then the Jews all went to Egypt to escape a famine and ended up as slaves for about 400 years. Then in the 13th century BCE then went back to the land of Israel and conquered it from foreign peoples with Joshua. Over the centuries, remnants of Jews remained the land but various foreign powers conquered the area and carried off many Jews to Persia, (Susa and other cities), to Babylon, etc. Which is partly how the Jews got scattered. Eventually Rome took over the area but a Rome saw it as the “land of the Jews” and that’s clear from extra-biblical texts of circa 1-100AD. Remember Islam wasn’t even created until 600s AD. So that explains (1) how Israel was the land of the Jews way before any Muslims took over and (2) why Jews became scattered away from their homeland.
Glad to know you don't let the truth get in the way of your story.
History disagrees.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Early_Muslim_conquests#/media/File:The_Early_Muslim_Conquests_630s_to_820s.svg
1. That was not "Jewish land"
2. Zionists were Ashkenazi Jews from Europe.
Irrefutable. Move on.
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In 1000, Jews were precisely 1-2% of Palestinians. In 1914, Jews were 8%. In 1948, after decades of immigration funded by European Zionists, Jews were still less than one-third vs Muslims two-thirds. It’s crazy to argue that because Jews dominated the region thousands of years ago they or the UN somehow had a right to create an “Israel” in 1948. It had been Muslim territory for far more than 1,000 years.
Returning Jews bought back land in Palestine from Muslims. So, Muslim sold their land to Jews. It wasn’t viewed as worth much at the time. But then those pesky Jews developed it into valuable real estate, embarrassing the Muslims.
A two state solution was offered, Jews accepted, Palestinians didn’t. Then there were two, or was it three, wars over disputed land. Muslims lost. Who gets to claim ownership of land when your side lost so many times? And their Muslim neighbors? They want no part of them.
Muslims have a history of conquering lands and trying to wipe out the past of the conquered. They can’t do that with Jews, even in Gaza. Another poster provided a link to an article about a pre-500, ie, pre Mohammad, synagogue in Gaza.
Just to be more historically correct, people in that land first were pagan, worshiping idols. Jews invented new monotheistic belief and were prosecuted and expelled from land by Babylonians, Persians, Greeks and Romans. Some carried on with their Jewish beliefs in exile for ever, some in 1st AD converted to Christianity, believing in Jesus Christ, who was a Jewish rabbi. In 7th century Islam started to spread from Arabian peninsula and came to Judea and Samaria forcefully converting mixture of population who lived there. Some were ethnically Jewish too.
Yes, the racist pig Erdogan has taken back Agia Sophia for Islam.
"they want Constantinople back"
Why did Constantinople get the works? that's nobody's business but the Turks ...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vsQrKZcYtqg
The ignorance of those protesters is astounding.
But look how they try to suck in the Hispanics.
That may work in the socialist republic of Los Angeles, but good luck trying to pull that off in Miami. Especially when wearing a Castro hat. I'm surprised the speaker wasn't chomping on a cigar.
Yeah, did you catch the Che Guevarra hat?
That was the first thing that caught my eye, along with the beard.
And for a "suffering and downtrodden" lot, they seem pretty well fed. Over fed, really.
Amen.
Some of them.
I'm pretty sure that's why she said "tend to be"....
It’s just like BLM all over again…probably funded by the same people…probably the same people behind the megaphones 🤷♀️🙄 I second that the ignorance is mind numbing and astounding.
The murderous arrogance is even worse. "Death to anyone I disagree with!"
The fact that they CANT see that this is what they are saying boggles my mind.
It requires a diploma from an elite college to achieve such a plateau of brainwashing. The CIA is envious. Or perhaps providing assistance?
Note they are given scripts.
Exactly 🤔
The woman who asserted that the Palestinian 'genocide' started on the very same day Jews were being murdered in Israel wins the grand prize for being the most deluded and incoherent of them all - though the girl calling for the decolonization of America came close.
Those were the two that stuck most in my mind as complete imbeciles. The term, Useful idiots, is a pretty good explanation of how they promote such a bankrupt ideology. The guy at the end of the video was perhaps the most chilling. He was very cautious in his response, but you could feel the venom in his responses.
Astounding and not surprising.
Indeed! But honestly, I would set a low bar for your average gathering in LA…
on a scale of one to eleven, I can't even.
Astonishing Ignorance: Sadly, it isn't. It's pretty much a requirement.
I was literally going to write what you wrote verbatim
Every time you talk to these brain dead you just wish they would wipe the drool off their chins.
You don't have to go to a zombie movie to see zombies, just go to one of these demonstrations.
"It's not about the Jews, it's about colonizers and the colonized."
Sell that story to someone dumb, protestors. It's about the Jews. If you were remotely interested in the other, you'd have been protesting every other nation on the face of the Earth. You picked Jews, and only Jews, because you think they can be pushed around.
IDF regrets to inform you otherwise.
I strongly believe what Bari and others have discussed before - Jews are the canary in the coal mine and have frequently been target first when major political upheavals and danger first starts. They are small in number and not prone to violence so get targeted more easily - but what starts with the Jews doesn’t end with the Jews. This political tension reflects trouble brewing in many ways across the globe. The Jews have often been among the first to sound the alarm. Look at these crowds, so ignorant most of them. Would not have any clue what to do or where to start when their group becomes the next target of hate and irrationality.
I agree with you except for “ you picked Jews and only Jews because you think they can be pushed around”.
That is not why they pick on Jews. The rabid Jew hatred we are seeing is something much deeper and more poisonous. It is age old blight on humanity that metastasizes through the ages. Early on it was against the Jews as a religion, then it was Jews as a culture, now it is Jews as colonizers ( zionists).
Anti Jew hatred unites groups that have nothing else in common( far right and far left , gays marching for Hamas! ,feminists not condemning the brutal gang races of Jewish women and marching for Hamas. Many many of these people are intelligent well read people. Antisemitism is an ancient evil that is resilient and dangerous and has nothing to do with IQ or bullying.
A mutual hatred of Jews is also the only thing with brings Sunni and Shite Muslims together.
edit: I would disagree with your assessment of these people as "intelligent and well read". To me they represent the exact opposite. They are very *selectively* read in that they only ever present a single viewpoint of any issue. And truly intelligent people seek to at least understand different perspectives even if they strongly support a single view. These people are mindless sheep. Very dangers mindless sheep.
I submit that antisemites run the entire gamut from least intelligent to the most intelligent.It defies logic
It's the same logic by which, depending on the speaker, we are corrupt capitalists or die-hard communists.
Jew haters have never needed logic. The cool/funny thing is, all those great empires that tried to exterminate us.....where are they today (dustbin of history)? Yet this minuscule percentage of world population is still here and thriving, despite the efforts of those long gone empires.
A fair point, Disa, thanks: antisemitism is as old as dirt, and this war is just the latest opportunity for haters to scream "Gas the Jews."
We Jews are so deeply grateful to those who see the hatred for the ugliness it is and support our right to exist. Having Israel is vitally important for all Jews both in Israel and the diaspora.These last five weeks have been a nightmare I knew was always possible but hoped I would never see.
You are not alone! I’m not a Jew but I know hatred when I see it. I stand with Israel. ❤️
I'm an evangelical Christian, not Jewish, but I grew up with a Jewish boy in my grade whose parents survived WWII. They were the nicest family. I studied at Hebrew Union College when I was at USC in my undergrad years, and I pledged a Jewish sorority at SC. I'm sure there is a Jewish person out there I wouldn't like, but in all these years I haven't met one. I can't understand antisemitism at all, it just doesn't register.
Anti-Semitism is satanic. Pure and simple.
That is precisely the key to all of it.
We are seeing the results of years of indoctrination “ capitalism is bad “, “western culture is bad”...etc and Jews are easy scapegoats. Most civilized countries destroyed themselves from within. Maybe we are witnessing the collapse phase?
Because it's much easier to scream out "Death to the colonizers" than it is "Death to Jews", even though they convey the very same intent.
Also for a group of people who sure love to say America is bad and we should embrace other cultures ideals, they sure love applying America's colonial narrative to every other nation on Earth. Israel never had the Mayflower lolol.
👍🔥
Shane, the quote you started with could only have easily come out of the mouth of a person representing a profession I suspect was quite numerous in that demonstration: a college professor.
Cool, Penny. It's the single most compelling book title I've ever seen, and I read it when Horn published it.
ALSO, David Baddiel "Jews Don't Count"
The absolute cluelessness of so many college students is breathtaking. They have no clue about how ugly the world they advocate for would be.
Armchair warriors
Actually, I think the reality is even worse: more than likely, most of them would be the first to succumb to, be offed, in this new world order they so stridently advocate - this goes 100x for the sexual/gender outliers; the homosexual, the queer, the transsexual, anything that does not rigorously conform to the male-female, extremist PATRIARCHY of Islam. But this doesn’t just follow for the Islamist fascists, my understanding has been that divergent views in anything is quashed by these repressive ‘isms.
What has always been so riotous to me is that these, to me, digressions from the norm have all arisen and "flourished " in those societies that are western, economically diverse, Christian historically,-- all societies they wish to destroy.
Yep!!!
These "human rights" warriors chant support for people who treat women like garbage and throw gays off rooftops. Clueless is being kind.
"it sure would be nice if we could say with a straight face that Israel’s current government has pursued nothing but peaceful coexistence with its Palestinian neighbors."
That's true for Israel's current government, but Israel has been trying to make peace with Palestinians--and give them the land they claim they want for their own state--since 1967. Pali leaders, most notably Arafat, responded with The Three Nos.
If Palis want peaceful co-existence--hell, I do too--they need to find leaders who will bargain in good faith, make the deal, and built their state already.
And ask the nice Jewish neighbors for cups of sugar, not fuel for Hamas rockets.
I listened to Lex Fridman interview Jared Kushner. He said there is Arab and non Arab money willing to invest in rebuilding Gaza so Palestinians can have lives and prosper. The obstacle? Hamas.
This convinced me that Palestinians are just worthless pawns, cannon fodder of their own fellow Muslims. I wonder if deep down they know this, but can’t face the fact so blame the Jews.
Yes Palestine is the only “country” that has its own UN refugee organization. So much money has gone to trying to give them humanitarian aid— and Hamas and other corrupt leaders have taken most, if not all, of it.
When are we gonna learn that we cannot keep giving money that ends up in Hamas’s hands?
If the Muslims are in such solidarity with each other, then why hasn’t Jordan or Egypt come to help Palestinians or helped Palestine refugees escape? Everyone is all up in arms about the bombing of a refugee camp in Gaza— but they don’t ask the question: why hasn’t there been more effort made by Hamas or Arab leaders to find new homes for these refugees? Why hasn’t another Muslim country taken them in?
I agree, it seems like the Muslim world is content to let Palestinians be the sacrifice needed to justify their jihad. Palestinians should be angry not at the Jews but at their fellow Arab Muslim counties who do nothing to help and only propagandize their sacrificial deaths for their own agendas.
If you look into why Arab nations won't take in Palestinian refugees, the reason is two-fold:
First, forcing Palestinians to remain refugees is a way of insuring there will always be an excuse to try to destroy Israel. This was a major factor for many years, because until Israel had defeated them in battle several times, the surrounding Arab countries were in a constantly attitude of war against Israel. This is becoming less significant as the leaders of more Arab nations have realized that Israel simply isn't going away.
Second, Palestinians have proven themselves to be very harmful immigrants wherever they have been allowed to go in the Arab world. They tried to assassinate the King of Jordan. They took over the southern part of Lebanon and continue to engage in civil war. Palestinian immigrants in Kuwait supported Iraq's invasion of Kuwait. And they support the Muslim Brotherhood, which is why Egypt wants nothing to do with them.
Good post. There are two (or more) sides to every story. The side you just described is rarely, if ever, mentioned. You are correct.
Excellent points.
Thanks for this, Maureen. I believe Kushner is correct--if Palestinians could find a leadership willing to make a deal with Israel for a State of Palestine, there would be all kinds of global money flowing in to help them turn the place into a wonderland. If Palis can't find those kind of leaders, than the much bigger Muslim family needs to step in and do it for them. The terrorism hurts them all, so they all need to fight it.
The murder cults of Islam--Hamas, Hezbollah, ISIS, Islamic Jihad, etc.--will not abide by a State of Palestine that does not replace Israel and become part of the Caliphate they want to restore. They will actively fight Israel AND any Pali brave enough to say, "Not in my name, Hamas." These jihadists hate modern and moderate Muslims as much as they do Jews, and murder them with as much glee.
Israel, even with U.S. backing, can't win that fight on its own. The only counterweight to Iran and the jihadists is the Muslim world, which needs to band together to crush the jihadists not just to protect Palis, but themselves, who are also targets of the murder cults. There were signs of that happening with the Saudi-Israel talks, which is why Hamas launched its massacre--they saw those signs too and knew that if peace reigned, they'd disappear.
As terrible as this crisis is, it is also an opportunity: back-channel as the war rages, make the two-state deal, form a Middle Eastern NATO against the terrorists and Iran, and start doing business with both Israel and New Palestine. The jihadists are a danger to the Saudis and Jordanians, too, and it's time for the region to deal with it.
a ME NATO, interesting thought. Anti terrorist and anti Iran. I suppose that means Biden would have to stop enabling Iran.
Plus, it could be called MEATO, which is a hilarious acronym . . .
I really hope this is in the works. It’s the only thing I’ve heard that makes sense. 🤞
Yet today MBS hosted Nasrallah and Assad . Arabs getting together to discuss the Jewish problem..
i think back channeling the Saudi-Israeli-US deal during this war is not only doable, but necessary. It looks like, and I hope I'm not premature, that the American military presence is forcing Hezbollah to stay put, and that the crisis in Gaza remains local. And if it remains containable, I think the Saudis can commit to (very) quiet negotiations to continue their entente with Israel. Saudi Arabia is no fan of either Hamas or Hezbollah - and will happily steamroller over them if given the diplomatic space.
Agreed. I'm no fan of Bonesaw Arabia, but it's big, powerful, has American weaponry, and is a very good counterweight to Iranian aggression. If it has finally tired of the Palestine bullshit it helped foment all these decades and wants the problem to disappear, more power to it. May the back channels prove profitable for all except Iran and the assassins it employs to even the Arab world's detriment.
Some say SA is playing games, but I thought it significant that the biggest players in the region--SA, Jordan, etc.--all vetoed a resolution at last week's Arab States conference calling for a total severance of relations with Israel. SA talks tough about Israel, but it's quietly working in Israel's favor. We'll see what's real and make-believe as this war continues, methinks--I do believe that great change can come only from great crises, and maybe this crisis is so huge that the Arab nations will force the issue on Palestine.
I believe the war will be contained to Gaza, in part because the Arab states dislike the Islamic death cults more than they dislike Israel. They can do business with Israel, and the death cults want SA and other states to die in favor of Caliphate-like versions. My only real worry is that if Israeli "settlers" keep murdering West Bank Arabs, that will provide the death cults an excuse to start up a second front in the Bank.
"Bonesaw' is an apt description of SA - but of course, we can't let perfection be the enemy of the good. We need the Saudis to throw their indelicate weight around, they're transactional and practical. They and Israel have a common enemy in Iran and that alone should compel them both to stay at the negotiating table.
Your worry re the West Bank is real. The settler issue has been the thorn in the side of a realistic settlement for two decades. Only when Netanyahu and his right wing coalition is gone can we even see a glimmer of hope there - but not before, imo.
They are also taught to blame the Jews from birth on. It’s in Tot TV and in the schools.
They are taught more than to blame the Jews. UNRWA teaches them to hate and kill Jews. Hence the recorded audio from 10 -7 of the jihadi calling his parents back in Gaza-bragging that he killed ten Jews “ tell mom she’ll be so proud”. This is not an exaggeration . When this war is declared over the task of deprogramming this culture must begin if there is ever to be a chance for peace.
Listening to that Nasrallah ‘s rant today I think “ this man is a hateful misogynistic arrogant sack of shit.
Iran heading the human rights council at the UN
Assad the man who used ricin on his own people talking about human rights to Israel the only democracy in the Middle East
The world is burning
Not even pawns. Collaborators. And where did all those homegrown Hamas fighters come from?
As with any group it is not a monolith. Some know it some don’t. Until the Palestinians give up the delusion of their refugee status and accept the right of both Jews and Palestinian arabs( both Muslim and Christian) to live side by side in the land , there can be no peace. I urge people to read and watch ( YouTube) Einstein Wilf Phd on this topic. She is an Israeli intellect, politician with deep roots in the peace camp. She spoke this past week to a group on Capitol Hill ( rec on YouTube) . Please watch and share your thoughts with me
Yes, Israel and the Great Satan are the scapegoats.
The fact that you say “this convinced me that Palestinians are worthless _______” it doesn’t even matter the rest of the sentence. This is the red flag for me that somewhere there is rot in the narrative that is justifying the mass killing of Gazans for the past month. Grossly disproportionate to anything that ostensibly provoked it. I never knew much about the history of the region before a month ago but have been looking into it, reading and listening to both sides and find SOOO many gaps in the story-telling I now read on places like this. THIS is how humans become convinced that a genocide is ok and look away. THIS is what “never again” refers to. It takes discernment to get at the truths that matter most. There are always “reasons,” always justifications for things like what is happening right now to Gaza. Always. And it sounds right from a certain angle - from a certain lense. For me there is enough that echoes in the mistakes of history to see that the state of Israel IS the oppressor and what they are doing to Gaza is wrong. The Zionist project is wrong and this is its logical conclusion.
Everything about a protest - the judgment and character of the people there - doesn’t have to be perfect for its underlying truth to be salient. I protested vaccine mandates at rallies with some speakers who I cringed about and did co-sign with, made me unsure attending was the right call. But the cause was the right cause. We were right about the injustice we were calling out. So are the pro-Palestinian protesters.
How is Israel an oppressor when (1) they have a longer claim to the land than Palestinians and (2) Arab nations have started every single war since day 1 of Israel’s creation?
As far as “justifications” for the war in Gaza— how do you expect Israel to act when they have been putting up with a hostile region in Gaza since 2005 and then from most recent Oct. 7th attacks?
Is self-defense not a good enough reason for you? What would “proportional” force look like, in your mind, against a maniacal death cult that encourages women and children to die for their cause? How does Israel engage an enemy that continual hides their military operations in schools, hospitals, and mosques?
Someone (sorry can’t recall who at the moment) recently said (paraphrase): if Hamas laid down their weapons tomorrow, there would be peace. If Israel lies down its weapons, there would be no Israel.
Any “mass” to the killings of Gazans this past month is 100% on the terrorist group of Hamas, NOT on Israel. If you think otherwise, you either have listened to too much Arab propaganda about the situation OR you really misunderstand the international rules of war and what it takes to stop terrorism.
Oh yes. And I WILL judge the character of these idiots who don’t know history and who justify terrorism. I think justice requires we do cast judgement on those who want to both apologize for acts of terror and who essentially say that all Jews in the world should be dead.
Is your comment even worth replying to? “ostensibly provoked?” Do you need to see, eg, a video of a Hamas guy beheading a Jew with a shovel and then sending a photo to the victim’s mom? And then the Hamas guy phoned his own mom and bragged with glee about what he had done? What justification can you offer for THAT?
You claim ignorance, OK you have a lot of catching up to do.
here’s a tiny sampler of perspective.
Hamas, HAMAS, uses Palestinians as human shields. Schools and hospitals are used to house ammunition. Why? why not have depots of ammunition so if your enemy needs to blow up your ammo, no children or sick people are put at risk? Because HAMAS doesn’t give two shits about Palestinians. To them they are worthless. If they get bombed, it’s a good thing, because Hamas gets sympathy from uninformed people. Like you.
Today Israeli soldiers were escorting Palestinians out of Gaza, giving them safe passage. Israeli soldiers put themselves at risk to protect Palestinians. Did you hear?
Before 10/7 Israel had increased the number of Palestinians allowed in to Israel to work. Unemployment in Gaza is 50%. Looks bad for Palestinians to be getting jobs from Jews, huh?
HAMAS has controlled Gaza since 2006 and nothing has been done to improve the lives of those people. The leaders live in luxury in Qatar and rob the people of billions in foreign financial aid. Cement and piping to construct housing is taken to make hundreds of miles of tunnels and bombs. Those tunnels have been dug into Israel, under day care centers. So they can bomb little Jewish children.
One more thing— it was the Palestinians who refused the two state solution offered in 1948. They lost three wars since. Bad decision on their part.
They just don’t care; they start from a place where Israeli Jews are bad, but they don’t admit it—perhaps not even to themselfes, assuming they are who they purport to be online, a big IF; then they read garbage to justify their initial bigotry and come out sounding like an even handed person.
Disproportionate my ass. Read about Nagasaki and Dresden. Totally justified. War is hell. If you don’t like your people dying, don’t start a fucking war. Case closed.
Evidently you are not aware that every Arab country that has offered refuge to Palestinians has ended up regretting it. When a group of people behave consistently in a way that causes even their Muslim brethren to want nothing to do with them, rushing to take their side because they're being disparaged and attacked (in a war they started) is naïve.
If you really stopped reading at the word “worthless” and didn’t finish with the rest of her statement you missed her point entirely. She said worthless cannon fodder for their fellow Muslims, not to herself personally.
In response to all the incredulity at my comments, I will simply share what I have been reading and listening to. It would be impossible to respond to it all. After having learned more about the history, the configuration of the map (land from non-Jews being slowly taken over TO THIS DAY), the lack of rights for even Israeli citizens that are not Jewish, I think anyone who takes an honest look can see how the state of Israel is an oppressor.
As for where I am learning my information (besides my initial introduction from my paid subscription to The Free Press)
- I just finished reading Miko Peled’s (the son of a decorated IDF general who fought for Israel both in 1948 and 1967) book The General’s Son - finally finished it last night. 90% of the people whose voices I have been listening to in order to inform my opinion are Jewish. Many of them have close ties to the holocaust which informs their take on victimization.
I have great respect for who recognize that an ethnostate like Israel doesn’t automatically represent them and shouldn’t, and are decrying the decimation of Gaza saying “Not in my name.” As a Christian, I have a similar feeling. One young (Jewish) man who is an active member of Jewish Voices for Peace says he grew up in the Midwest where the majority of Zionist he lived around were Christian Zionists. He says there are more Christian zionists in the world today than Jewish people. This makes me cringe as I understand the romantic impulse to interpret scripture in a way that confidently believes the modern state of Israel is a god-ordained project.
One of the first things I read in The Free Press on October 8 was the article about the famous Ecclesiastes chapter 3. I thought that was a great idea and proceeded to read the whole book of Ecclesiastes over the next few days. My biggest takeaway was a verse from chapter 7: “it’s best to stay in touch with both sides of an issue. A person who fears God deals responsibly with all of reality, not just a piece of it.”
Funny how Israeli people are allowed to be critical of government policy - but Palestinian people never express the same regrets of government policy publicly re: Hamas and Fatah.
Did you happen to "research" a timeline of more than 75 years? Just curious.
And did you happen to come across in your "research" the amount of colonizing and settling in Syria and Algeria and Egypt and Persia and Afghanistan that forced EVERY SINGLE JEW to get up and leave THEIR ancestral homelands? Who should be held accountable for those GENOCIDAL APARTHEID WAR CRIMES?
Did you happen to come across in your "research" the 1947 partition plan endorsed by the United Nations, and agreed to by Israel... but rejected by every single Arab nation?
Did you happen to come across in your "research" which Arab nations welcomed the Palestinian "refugees" with open arms after 1948?
Do better "research" next time.
If you have the chance, read about Israel being attacked in 48, 67 and 73. It really does seem like God protected them. It is astonishing that they survived.
Tellingly, not a single Muslim stood up on October 8 and said, “not in my name” to the gang rapes and murder.
“After learning more about the history…”
Just what “more” do you imagine you learned about the history?
Which specific lack of rights for citizens who are not Jewish do you mean, and didn you ever notice how many Muslim nations have zero non-Muslims allowed, not only disallowed to be citizens or live there as non-citizens, but Jews cannot even enter, and you quibble about some rights someone told you non-Jews lack in Israel?
Abbas says in his new state not one Jew will be allowed —but that’s just fine with you? What a load.
It's not that hard to find fairly neutral pieces on Arab rights in Israel. This is pretty good and from what I would consider to be a reliable source: https://www.cfr.org/backgrounder/what-know-about-arab-citizens-israel. My only real complaint about the piece is it makes it seem as if 700,000 Palestinians spontaneously "fled or were expelled" from Israel. In fact, militants in the territory attacked Israel.
If those refugees had been granted citizenship, permanent housing and jobs in the places to which they fled, we wouldn't be having this conversation. That's not to excuse the forfeiture. We can talk reparations for everyone who lost property during that time -- including the 800k Jews who unwillingly forfeited property in the Arab states. It's just to say you don't hear Arab Jews talk much about their own refugee status because they WERE housed, fed and employed.
JVP does not represent mainstream Jewish thought. You should read a wider variety of opinions and experiences. 99% of the countries on this planet are analogous to ethnostates. With the exception of America, perhaps, all expect their immigrants to assimilate. France's secularism is a perfect example, but the entire EU is regretting their huge influx of Muslims because they are changing the national "character" of those countries. I think you're just confused because Judaism is part of Israel's national character.
Ongoing West Bank settlements are bad. Anyone who claims land was given to them alone by God is delusional, which includes Hamas. Handing the government to the fundamentalist fringe is never a good idea -- Gaza and Israel are both cases in point.
Arafat never missed an opportunity to miss an opportunity. I know it's an overused trope - but it is still relevant. Unfortunately.
It ain't just that old whore. It's the whole lot.
Remember when the left was against war and big pharma? I member! Every free press reader should take a pledge not to vote for the party that backs these psychopaths.
You should head over to San Francisco next week for some before and after photos. They finally got rid of homeless encampments to save face in front of CCP dictator Xi Jinping and his Commiefornia court eunuch Gavin.
I left my heart in Potemkin Village.
They should hand out pictures of the real daily SF to the conventioneers.
Finally, we can thank the Chinese for something..
My God, it’s starting to feel like you’re better off hiring high school students than your college grads. We’re in a lot of trouble once these people decide that they want positions of power and start running for office.
high school students from Iowa. of any fly over state
Nah - just remember - even in New York and California, 40% of the votes went to the (R) party. It's the morons that always provide the electoral differences.
Amen 🙏
There’s a reason why responsible businesses used to have dress codes and didn’t give people with chartreuse hair the time of day as either customers or employees.
Hire grads from the party schools.
“global intifada”—by which he meant the overthrow of capitalism—“is a desire shared by all working people across the world.”
The only people I've ever heard calling for the overthrow of Capitalism are tatted, over pierced, purple haired baristas and burger flippers; you know, those young people who think the world owes them a living and want everyone else to pay for it.
What was smart of the interviewer here was to never interject on who was speaking to logically rebut him or her. He didn't have to. Their answers stood out in sharp contrast to anything remotely comprehensible.
"Okay, working class, this is your last chance! Revolt now! Or else."
The have despaired of the working class and adopted the homeless class instead as their vanguard.
Yep 👍
Case in Point: Caffe Aronne in Manhattan. Google it before the algorithm sends it down the memory hole.
https://nypost.com/2023/11/11/opinion/all-of-nyc-helped-when-my-pro-hamas-staff-quit-caffe-aronne/
Great job. Takes about 5 seconds of questions to see how shallow these peoples' understanding of the situation is.
I couldn't get through even 45 seconds of that without feeling nauseous. The first five words say all you need to hear, "Peace is not the answer." That this comes from the mouths of a group called "Peace and Freedom Party" is an irony only Orwell could truly appreciate.
At the risk of being labeled a tinfoil hat conspiracy theorist, I can't help but wonder how this intensely savage anti-Semitic movement (for lack of a better word) came together in such a quick amount of time. The first of their now endless hatefest rallies began less than 24 hours after the Hamas assault. FFS, the bodies of the slaughtered innocents were not even cold yet before "River to the Sea" echoed from bullhorns across the country -- and the world.
You can't tell me that this was purely organic, "grass roots" organizing. I'm more than willing to accept that the FBI or even the CIA has a hand in this. Consider for a moment the shift in public dialog. Just like that, nobody is talking about Ukraine, the impending implosion of the economy (Moody's just downgraded the U.S. again yesterday), transphobia, climate "crisis" any more. Death to Israel is the new "Latest Thing". Because the carbon footprint of massive and endless war doesn't count.
But silence is violence
And arson is speech
I also agree it's a conspiracy, but that China is behind it. Their psy-op campaign, which has divided our nation, has to be the most successful in history.
As the Free Press has pointed out repeatedly, the ignorance of history and even of current events expressed by these “protesters” is due to the total capture of our education system, from kindergarten through University. Unless we reform the educational system, we will continue down this path. Withholding donations to Universities is a start but much more needs to be done.
So disgusting... There may be hope for the Israelis, but this country isn't going to last much longer.
I read yesterday that the difference between our politicians and the Israeli's, is that their children are in the IDF. Skin in the game always brings clarity of purpose.
The most pathetic of all the pathetic individuals in this video is the woman who rambles on about DACA when asked what decolonization would look like here. Here, decolonization would look like Native Americans storming into her home and scalping her and her family. If she isn't OK with that, she shouldn't be OK with it happening to Israelis.
No the most pathetic was the lump of flesh who thinks October 7 was when the gazans were attacked
My thought exactly. Oh, and then taking her little sister hostage.
I know I shouldn’t be shocked, but I always am. These people are so unbelievably ill informed. They know nothing about nothing, yet they’re out there marching in the streets. These useful idiots put us all in danger. The young lady on the stage talking about growing mangoes obviously has no idea that Israel left countless greenhouses in Gaza when they withdrew in 2005. Hamas burned down every single one of them. She has no idea that Palestine is run by kleptocrats who line their pockets by stealing aid money. Ugh.
Jewish blood really stirs up these monsters.
I believe that the notion that these "kids" are going through their adolescent idealistic crazies and will grow out of it is wishful thinking. They have been radicalized in their cultish zeal and have actively invested too much of themselves in their delusions to acknowledge the naiveté of their imagined enlightenment. The theme of antisemitism is the current rallying focus serving to reenforce their sense of meaning, purpose and identity as crusaders, but when that loses its momentum and no longer provides the self-elevating shot-in-the-arm that it does today, there will be the next straw enemy to provide "purpose". If they continue to be treated like youths needing patient tolerance, they will likely get more organized and possibly even more radical. I'm afraid that the US is entering a long struggle with its own home grown expression of the ISIS phenomenon.